Action with no serial number
There is a seller on another auction site that has listed an action (complete receiver and bolt) for a swiss rifle that was part of a special manufacturing run in 1981 and was never completed as a rifle.
The seller states that the action never had a serial number put on it, and there are only a few factory inspection marks.
Am I wrong, or is this a VERY illegal item?
Is there any way to legally register it -- by stamping on a serial number (I assume someone with a manufacturer's license would have to do this.)
The seller states that the action never had a serial number put on it, and there are only a few factory inspection marks.
Am I wrong, or is this a VERY illegal item?
Is there any way to legally register it -- by stamping on a serial number (I assume someone with a manufacturer's license would have to do this.)
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It depends.
In some European countries, it's the BARREL, not the receiver, that is serial-numbered & controlled. If the receiver in question is still in Switzerland, it may well be legal.
But, if the receiver is in the US, the importer would have been required to stamp it with a serial number & importer markings. If the item is in the US, was made > 1967, & does not have a serial number, it is contraband & anyone in possession could run into legal problems.
Neal
EDIT: Fisher said that the item is a "complete receiver"; I have no reason to question what he has said. He did not tell us if the seller indicated that he must ship to an FFL; if so, how many FFL's are willing to accept a modern receiver without a serial number, especially if it's a model that he KNOWS was not made < 1968? He'd be crazy if he didn't call ATF. Fisher also didn't tell us what type receiver it is; for sure, it isn't a Vetterli. Yes, the ADA may need to PROVE when it was made to get a conviction, but only a reasonable suspicion is needed to make an arrest. I hate prison food, but that's just me.
An individual can manufacturer most types of firearms for his own use without a manufacturers license. However, a homemade firearm cannot be transferred.0 -
quote:Originally posted by 1fisher
There is a seller on another auction site that has listed an action (complete receiver and bolt) for a swiss rifle that was part of a special manufacturing run in 1981 and was never completed as a rifle.
The seller states that the action never had a serial number put on it, and there are only a few factory inspection marks.
Am I wrong, or is this a VERY illegal item?
Is there any way to legally register it -- by stamping on a serial number (I assume someone with a manufacturer's license would have to do this.)
Why? Why register it when you can't "register" a weapon with the Fed. And why would you tell them you have another firearm? Don't they know enough about you anyway? By letting them know that you have it just adds to the count they're gonna ask for when the goons in black SUVs show up and demand your firearms.
So WHY? Why would you worry about it?
[:D]0 -
I don't think A SN# was required untill the late 60's. My marlin 62m. 256 dosen't have A sn# and I'm not worryed. 0 -
No serial # required prior to '68...
JIM.................0 -
According to the seller, the receiver was manufactured in 1981.
Also, it is here in the US and there are no import marks on it - the only thing shown in a photo are a couple of inspectors marks.
It is really no big deal to me - I was just curious about it. I thought the same as nmeyers, and I wanted to learn if I was wrong or not.
Thanks!0 -
Well, as mentioned, if it was imported into the USA after 1968 as a functional firearm its supposed to have a serial number on it. That number could be put on the gun by the original manufacturer, or by the importer.
Assuming the importer still exists, its probably NOT too late for them to do this. A simple electropencil or engraved/stencilled number would suffice. "Serial # Ifisher00001". . .done.
I can see maybe one exception here.
If the gun was never actually put into working condition (ie the receiver was never finished), then technically its not a gun, and it wouldn't need a serial number until it was finished.
If you purchased the unfinished receiver then finished it yourself, you wouldn't need to put a serial number on it. . .though you could never legally transfer the gun.
EDIT: Frisky-Maddog:
This is off topic, but apart from the pride of doing so yourself (which I admit, might be pretty high), there isn't much advantage to building your own gun from an 80% receiver.
That's especially true of a 10/22 when full used guns are available relatively inexpensively. You can get a nice new 80% receiver here, for $125 shipped, but finishing it isn't trivial, since you have to drill multiple precise holes, and tap at least one more. http://www.ruger1022receiver.com/
Once done, you still have to sink in more money for a bolt, charging handle, finishing the raw aluminum receiver (though I suppose you wouldn't absolutely HAVE to do that), and of course, any custom parts you'd need to complete the gun.
If you figure you can buy a whole used 10/22 gun for about $200, and maybe even defray part of that cost by selling off the parts you want to swap out for customization (eg barrel, stock, etc), it probably just doesn't pay to build your own.
If you're paranoid about government intrusion and want an "unpapered" gun, in many states there are plenty of other perfectly legal ways to get one. (Well, at least right now there are).
Should you go down the "self made gun" route, you don't need to pay taxes on a gun you make yourself *BUT* unless you are yourself a licenced gun manufacturer, and go through the appropriate paperwork and taxes, you can't EVER legally sell or transfer the self-made gun you have.0 -
bean town has it right I also ask you how could ANYONE prove the action was made after 1968. . I had a Magnum mauser #5 action made before 1968 in the white I sent to a famous shop to install a match grade barrel in 1980 I was very disappointed when they put a serial number on it before shipping back I was going to have it machined engraved with my name #1 before rust blueing but as they say about best laid plans [:(!] 0 -
hello
http://www.ruger1022receiver.com/
i have wondered the same thing about the 10/22 80% receiver because i have thought about getting one and putting the finishing touches on it but wonder about the required $200 manufacturing registration fee? if so then it would be just as easy to buy a new 10/22 and toss everything but the receiver.0 -
quote:Originally posted by frisky-maddog
hello
http://www.ruger1022receiver.com/
i have wondered the same thing about the 10/22 80% receiver because i have thought about getting one and putting the finishing touches on it but wonder about the required $200 manufacturing registration fee? if so then it would be just as easy to buy a new 10/22 and toss everything but the receiver.
Read a bit more... plenty of info on this and other sites if you just search... (an individual does not pay a $200 manufacturing registration fee on anything except allowable NFA items).
And you should start your own topic instead of hijacking someone elses.0
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