45-70 TRAPDOOR 2
THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH FOR YOUR HELP. THAT WAS MY NEXT QUESTION, WHETHER OR NOT THE WEAPON WOULD BE SAFE TO USE WITH MODERN AMMUNITION. I HAVE A MODERN RIFLE VERSION THAT WAS PRODUCED BY H&R AND I REALLY ENJOY SHOOTING IT. IF I HAVE A GUNSMITH OK THE WEAPON DO YOU THINK IT WILL BE SAFE TO USE? IT HAS BEEN IN MY FAMILY FOR AS LONG AS I CAN REMEMBER AND I HAVE NEVER FIRED IT. I DID MEASURE TO THE POINT WHERE THE BARREL SCREWS IN. THE FULL LENGTH OF THE BARREL TO THE END INSIDE THE LOADING CHAMBER IS 22" WOULD THAT BE THE CORRECT WAY TO MEASURE IT?
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The correct way to measure is to close the breechblock and run a dowel through the barrel and mark it at the muzzle. If it's 22" and the barrel is crowned at the muzzle with the original front sight, it could be a carbine barrel. Nonetheless, it has a rifle stock, hardware and rear sight.
I assume the breechblock is stamped "US Model 1884" at the top. If it's a Model 1873 with a "high arch", meaning the underside of the block is scooped out almost to the top, you can only fire blackpowder as it could blow open using smokeless loads.
Still, I would shoot blackpowder loads or "Cowboy" loads after having it checked over by a gunsmith. They're fun shooters and I used to carry one for deer hunting!0 -
THANKS AGAIN. ITS A 1873, THE STAMPED NUMBERS ARE COMPLETELY GONE BUT I FOUND JUST A HINT OF THEM IN THE GLARE OF THE LIGHT. DO YOU KNOW IF ANYBODY OFFERS SOME COWBOY OR BLACKPOWDER LOADS ON THE MARKET TODAY OR WOULD I HAVE TO LOAD THEM MYSELF. I CERTAINLY DID NOT WANT TO USE THE WEAPON IF IT WAS OF ANY SUBSTANTIAL VALUE, BUT IT APPEARS WE HAVE ANSWERED THAT SO I AM GOING TO HUNT WITH IT, HAVE BEEN WANTING TO FOR A LONG TIME. THANKS AGAIN SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME AND HELP, BILL 0 -
quote:Originally posted by AC57
THANKS AGAIN. ITS A 1873, THE STAMPED NUMBERS ARE COMPLETELY GONE BUT I FOUND JUST A HINT OF THEM IN THE GLARE OF THE LIGHT. DO YOU KNOW IF ANYBODY OFFERS SOME COWBOY OR BLACKPOWDER LOADS ON THE MARKET TODAY OR WOULD I HAVE TO LOAD THEM MYSELF. I CERTAINLY DID NOT WANT TO USE THE WEAPON IF IT WAS OF ANY SUBSTANTIAL VALUE, BUT IT APPEARS WE HAVE ANSWERED THAT SO I AM GOING TO HUNT WITH IT, HAVE BEEN WANTING TO FOR A LONG TIME. THANKS AGAIN SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME AND HELP, BILL
OK, the breechblock has also been replaced since your receiver was made in 1886. Still, it should be ok to shoot with blackpowder after you get it checked out.
GOEX makes balckpowder .45-70 cartridges. You can get it from Midway or other sellers. Here's a link:
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=5592540 -
"IF I HAVE A GUNSMITH OK THE WEAPON DO YOU THINK IT WILL BE SAFE TO USE?"
Well, if a G/S OK's the firearm, it is safe to use. He's seen it..we haven't. Now, the ammunition..
I believe the commercially available Remington 350gr hollowpoint/405gr semi-jacket rounds are OK to use in original 1873 trapdoors in good condition. Reason for my statement: The .45-70 Remington smokeless load was available fifty years prior to the introduction of 1873 reproductions, when all that was available were original firearms. Back in the day, I'm sure Remington would have printed on the box "Unsafe in 1873 Springfield Rifles", or "For Use In 1886 Winchester Rifles Only" if the load was too hot.
However, best heck with the cartridge manufacturer to confirm. If Remington OK's their product, then you are "good to go" right off the retailers shelf. Best, Joe
EDIT:
Spider..thanks for the "heads-up". Ref. pics below, what do you think? If your expert eye (you're the '73 guru on this forum, whether you like it or not)[:D] shows it as "low arch", then my post would still have merit? Remington factory .45-70 smokeless has always been under-loaded, and my read is that's because the round may wind up in '73's. What say ye? Thanks, Joe0 -
quote:Originally posted by givette
"IF I HAVE A GUNSMITH OK THE WEAPON DO YOU THINK IT WILL BE SAFE TO USE?"
Well, if a G/S OK's the firearm, it is safe to use. He's seen it..we haven't. Now, the ammunition..
I believe the commercially available Remington 350gr hollowpoint/405gr semi-jacket rounds are OK to use in original 1873 trapdoors in good condition. Reason for my statement: The .45-70 Remington smokeless load was available fifty years prior to the introduction of 1873 reproductions, when all that was available were original firearms. Back in the day, I'm sure Remington would have printed on the box "Unsafe in 1873 Springfield Rifles", or "For Use In 1886 Winchester Rifles Only" if the load was too hot.
However, best heck with the cartridge manufacturer to confirm. If Remington OK's their product, then you are "good to go" right off the retailers shelf. Best, Joe
Joe - The main reason I stressed blackpowder cartridges is due to the fact that he has an 1873 breechblock. If that's a "high arch" block, it would be risky using smokeless loads as they have a tendency to blow open with smokeless loads. If it's a later Model 1873 "low arch" block, smokeless would be fine. All repro's are of the "low arch" design. Since I didn't see any pics of the underside of the breechblock, I would rather err on the side of caution.0 -
OK , I HAVE A FEW MORE PHOTOS IF WE NEED SOME MORE ANGLES LET ME KNOW. THANKS AGAIN AND HAPPY FATHERS DAY!! BILL0 -
quote:Originally posted by AC57
OK , I HAVE A FEW MORE PHOTOS IF WE NEED SOME MORE ANGLES LET ME KNOW. THANKS AGAIN AND HAPPY FATHERS DAY!! BILL
Hi, Bill. You have a "low arch" block so it should be ok with smokeless power. As I suspected, your barrel has been cut. A lot of rifles were made into "carbines" and yours is among them. Thanks for the pics!0 -
HEY THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND KNOWLEDGE, YOU HELPED ANSWER SOME QUESTIONS THAT I HAVE HAD FOR A LONG TIME AND I APPRECIATE IT VERY MUCH.
BILL0 -
You're very welcome, Bill. [:)] 0
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