early model 16 gauge
I have a old 16 gauge side by side , that I want to use for pheasant hunting , Gun is a newport from mid 1900's the only 16 gauge shells I can find are around 1295 fps with a 3-1/4 dram 1-1/8 load of 5's , the chambers and barrels are in excellent shape. will this be a safe load? or do I need to find something a little lighter? they are high base shells and are not listed as magnum. any info is greatly appreciated ! Thanks
Kory
Kory
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Kory- there was an earlier 16 g shell that was NOT 2 and 3 quarters inches, it was (IIRC) 2 and 9/16ths. A modern 2 and 3/4ths WILL chamber- but being too long, when the shell tries to unfold on firing, it unfolds into the forcing cone, raising pressures quite a bit.
STRONGLY urge you to have a good shotgun smith examine your gun, and see what it needs to be fed. The earlier shells can be found, but not at Walmart. Old Western Scrounder and smiliar folks carry them.0 -
Kory,
Gun is a newport from mid 1900's...
Do you mean the 1950's?
Check the Gunbroker Auction side for 16 GA. shells.
Here is a list of 16 GA. shells from just one supplier:
http://www.rrarms.com/catalog.php?action=1045&brand=16-GA
While 16 GA. is not as popular as the 12 GA. there is still a viable market and a dedicated group of followers devoted to the 16 GA. shotguns. If your local suppliers don't handle it on a regular basis, ask them if you can put in a regular or seasonal order, if they have decent prices.
Best.0 -
As 11b6r mentioned, it would be wise to first have a competent smith determine the chamber length and whether or not the gun is safe to fire.
Once condition and chamber length are determined you can search the auction side here as well as online retailers for 2 3/4" cartridges. If 2 1/2" cartridges are required you can check out either Polywad or Ballistic Products.
http://www.polywad.com/guide.html#16 Gauge shotgun_shells
http://www.ballisticproducts.com/products.asp?dept=188
Polywad offers low pressure cartridges that IMHO are top shelf. Ballistic products carries Gamebore brand, which is a high pressure gartridge. Something in the neighborhood of 10,000-11,000 psi.0 -
Newport. A "Trade Brand Name" shotgun made by either Crescent Fire Arms (1892 to 1932), W.H. Davenport (1878 to 1910), Iver Johnson's Arms & Cycle Works (1871 to 1993) or Stevens Arms & Tool Company (1874 to date?). Should be chambered for short shell and low pressure powder. 0 -
thanks Guys ,
I checked the chambers and they look to be 2-3/4 but I am going today to have it double checked by my gunsmith , I wasn't sure of the proper shell (once chamber has been confirmed) on dram load , I know to stay away from magnums but wasn't sure if 3-1/4 dram was still to hot . at 1295 fps. Thanks again[:)]0 -
"Dram Equivalent" has nothing to do with pressures! It has nothing to do with the weight of the powder!
It's an archaic (during blackpowder overlap) method to determine just what amount in volume of BP would have theoretically been needed to achieve the same muzzle velocity. With modern smokeless powders, the dram equivalent may take up too much space for correct overpowder wad placement!!!
After the G/S checks the gun for safety, go with the correct hull length, and stay away from all but standard loads. Prior links have listed them.
Dram equivalent outlived its usefulness by eighty years, and means nothing now. Look at as you would a hand-crank sticking out the front grille of a car. I wish the Mfr's would stop listing D/E altogether. Best, Joe0 -
I had the gun looked at today , and gunsmith said they are 2-3/4 chambers , and not to shoot magnums or steel ( which I knew) and to also stay away from anything over 3 drams eq.If drams Eq. is not an issue then why is it that the shells I am seeing have max dram, or 3-1/4 dr. eq. and those loads tend to be considered magnum, and comparing the same in 12ga. for every 1/4 dram you take away it looses 55fps? pardon me here but if they are obviously adding more powder thne by nature isn't the pressure going to go up . (I am not being a smart a$$) I have also noticed that one brand says nothing about Magnum but they have 3-1/4 dram ,1-1/8 oz #5 shooting 1295 fps , and the next brand show 3-1/4 dram 1-1/8 oz#5's and they label at magnum? what I need is a safe shooting shell that I can pheasant hunt with . thanks for all you help ! it is truly aprreciated . [:D]
Kory0 -
quote:Originally posted by Kory
I had the gun looked at today , and gunsmith said they are 2-3/4 chambers , and not to shoot magnums or steel ( which I knew) and to also stay away from anything over 3 drams eq.If drams Eq. is not an issue then why is it that the shells I am seeing have max dram, or 3-1/4 dr. eq. and those loads tend to be considered magnum, and comparing the same in 12ga. for every 1/4 dram you take away it looses 55fps? pardon me here but if they are obviously adding more powder thne by nature isn't the pressure going to go up . (I am not being a smart a$$) I have also noticed that one brand says nothing about Magnum but they have 3-1/4 dram ,1-1/8 oz #5 shooting 1295 fps , and the next brand show 3-1/4 dram 1-1/8 oz#5's and they label at magnum? what I need is a safe shooting shell that I can pheasant hunt with . thanks for all you help ! it is truly aprreciated . [:D]
Kory
Simply go with the muzzle velocity, and keep it about 1200-1300 fps for 1oz shot throw-weight.
If Dram Equiv. were important, the .44 WCF and .45 Colt and .41 Colt and even the .38 S&W Spl. (which all started out blackpowder) would list a dram equivalent. Perhaps they did at one time, but not any longer. You'll never see drams used in the shotgun reloading manuals..they'll list powder throw-weights in grains, and shot weights in ounces. Drams are an archaic volume reference. Best, Joe0
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