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Collath? Westphal? German side x side

jerjen95
Attached is a link to a few photos of an old German side x side I have and would like to know more about and possibly restore. You will notice on the right side of the right barrel the pitting that has occured. I have been told because of thi the gun is "unsalvageable".
The marking on the gun in gold inlay are "H. Westphal". I have been told the trigger lock is trademarks a Collath. Could it be a Collath made ofr H. Westphal? I have seen other Westphal guns but am unable to find out info of a Westphal as a gunmaker. Would there be a source to rebuild the barrels? Any and all input and ideas you have is greatly appreciated!!!
http://s726.photobucket.com/albums/ww262/jerjen95/
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7 comments

Date Votes
  • rufe-snow
    Wilhelm Collath was a very noted maker of high quality sporting arms, in Germany from the 1890's until the Second World War. You have what was a very high quality, expensive combination gun, known as a "Cape Gun". To find one set up with bases for a scope is very unusual, in a "Cape Gun".

    My WAG is that "H. Westphal" was the man who the gun was custom made for. I can't find any Westphal listed in my references, as a gunmaker in Germany.

    If you have enough money, restoration is possible. It would take a real pro to do it though. It's not clear from the photos how deep the pitting is? If it is to deep to compromise the safety in firing the barrels. All the restoration would do would be to restore the gun cosmetically, for display or museum purposes.
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  • navc130
    You have a beautiful old Cape gun. From what I can see in the pictures, I would certainly NOT call it unsalvageable. It is not uncommon for old guns to be rusted and pitted. A judicious cleaning would be in order. You must be careful not to damage anything. At the least, fine steel wool and paint thinner / 3in1 oil will clean most of the rust areas. Maybe a brass brush to get into the pits.
    Go slow. Don't use steel wool on any surface you don't have to: however fine it is, it still leaves minute scratchs. There is a bronze wool, also. If you shoot it, MAKE SURE you use the proper ammunition: it may be VERY difficult or impossible to find. The shotgun chamber is probably 2 1/2 inches, not the American 2 3/4 inch length. The bore condition must be reasonably clean / smooth.
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  • jerjen95
    Thanks rufe-snow and navc130...I was reading some other posts regarding restoration and rust removers and was repeatedly seeing a product called BD SUPERLUBE. Thinking about trying it and a brass brush and gently working it to see what comes of it. The borings appear to be in good shape, but my goal is to first get it cleaned up, then have it inspected before I would attempt to shoot it. thanks for your responses!
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  • MP
    Your gun was made by Collath located in Frankfurt (the little one on the Oder river) Germany. It was made for H. Westphal who lived in Peine, Germany, you can also see his "HW" monogram directly below the name. At one time this was a very high grade gun and could be again if the restoration was done professionally. My recommendation would be that you do nothing beyond stopping further rust. This gun belongs in the hands of someone who understands proper restoration work.

    I would suggest that you post at http://www.doublegunshop.com there are some very experienced people who could help you.
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  • jerjen95
    appreciate the help. The pitting seems to be more of a surface rust and thankfully on the rifle side where there is more material to work with for restoration. I spoke with a reputable gunsmith in Colorado that seems to have an impressive shop and has done very impressive work. Anyone aware of a quality gunsmith in Illinois or Wisconsin one would recommend for something like this? Yes I want to restore it cosmetically, but would like to take it functionally as well.
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  • David Richard
    quote:Originally posted by jerjen95
    Attached is a link to a few photos of an old German side x side I have and would like to know more about and possibly restore. You will notice on the right side of the right barrel the pitting that has occured. I have been told because of thi the gun is "unsalvageable".
    The marking on the gun in gold inlay are "H. Westphal". I have been told the trigger lock is trademarks a Collath. Could it be a Collath made ofr H. Westphal? I have seen other Westphal guns but am unable to find out info of a Westphal as a gunmaker. Would there be a source to rebuild the barrels? Any and all input and ideas you have is greatly appreciated!!!
    http://s726.photobucket.com/albums/ww262/jerjen95/
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  • tjh1948
    Paul Lippold, RGS Restorations, Oshkosh, WI.

    Never had him do anything for me, but is in Wisconsin.
    Check his web page.
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