makarov ammo
does Makarov make a 9mm that is NOT a 9x18?, but is a true 9mm? i don't want a 9mm luger 9mm round. i was told this Makarov isa a 9mm Mak and i ask if it was 9x18 and was told no it was 9mm Mak. but, only ammo i can find that says 9mm Makarov shows 9x18 on the box. HELP PLEASE before i buy a weapon maybe i can't find ammo for?
bill
bill
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9 X 18mm is 9mm Makarov. 9X19mm is 9mm Luger and no Makarov pistol were produced in that caliber (maybe some prototypes, buts let's skip any links to bizzare Makarov calibres for this post). 9 X 17mm is .380 and there were Makaorvs imported in that caliber.
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NO, it is not a true 9mm, as 9mm is .3543". 9 x 18 or 9mm Makarov is .365" There is about .030" difference in the length of the cartridges.
You won't have a problem finding 9mm Makarov ammo, however you will have a problem finding it at local stores.0 -
There was a somewhat rare Walther made in a caliber called 9x18 Ultra/Police, that used a ".355 bullet. The only other 9x18 of any note is the aforementioend ".364 Makarov, 9x18mm. Any Makarov pistol you could buy, whether Russian, Chinese, East German, Bulgarian as far as the actual Makarov original design, or the Polish P-64 will be marked either 9x18mm, or 9mm Makarov...and they are one in the same. Great guns for not much money, the MAkarovs, and you can get ammo mail order or at most any Cabela's or Gander or BPS's. I feel they are far superior to some of the new cheap pistols on the market today; all steel, and a time proven design. 0 -
Regarding the 9mm Makarov round.
I second (or third) the other replies. The 9mm Makarov IS the 9x18mm cartridge. Do not be fooled by those who tell you differently. See Mark's reply with the photos of the cartridge boxes in case you are confused.
Some clarifications (or maybe to muddy the water) :-) regarding the Makarov pistol (NOT whether the above replies are accurate...they are accurate). If my memory serves me right, the Makarov was designed to replace the larger Tokarov pistol, which fires the very, very hot 9x25mm bottle-necked-cased round. The Makarov, due to its small size and blowback design, cannot safely handle the more powerful 9x19mm Luger cartridge and so, was not chambered for it. Besides as a propriatary Russian weapon, they would not want to chamber their new weapon in the same round as a potentially unfriendly country. In creating the Makarov, the Russians picked up on the Walther design pistols AND the Walther 9x18mm Ultra cartridge, which was not in use as a military cartridge by other countries, and the Russians either used the cartridge as-is or redesigned it into the 9mm Makarov cartridge. The Russians did not clone the Walther design gun, but borrowed heavily from its design features. The 9mm Makarov pistol is really its own unique design internally and externally.
I think that for the money, it is impossible to find a handgun today that will compare to the design, functionality, reliability and size of the Makarov pistol, in ANY of its incarnations, be they Russian, East German, Polish, Chinese, etc. The Makarov is an excellent defense weapon and one of the few I will trust my life to. I rank it up their with the much higher priced guns in reliability. And, I am talking right-out-of-the-box reliability, too.
Russian 9x18mm Makarov ammo is readily available online. Most local gun stores do not stock it, although occasionally you can find it at some of the major sporting goods stores. It is usually all imported stuff, and I have never had a failure to fire. I would, be careful of Tula branded ammo, however.
Someone mentioned the .380acp caliber Makarov imports. Yes, they are out there and I have two of them. They were made specifically for export to the USA and all will have an adjustable rear sight. The two I have are Russian, made by Baikal and originally chambered in caliber .380acp. I do not know who else made Makarovs chambered in .380acp.
Further to the 9x18 Makarov cartridge and the .380acp (a.k.a 9x17mm or 9mm Kurz) cartridge, the Makarov in 9x18mm Makarov cartridge, can be converted to 9x17mm/.380acp by changing out the barrel. No other modification should be necessary and the same magazines will work. However, these aftermarket barrels used to be fairly inexpensive but have increased significantly in price and are somewhat difficult to find now. A few years back, there was an ATF/FBI brouhaha related to Makarov barrel switching, which may have contributed to the decline in availability of these aftermarket barrels. Check GunBroker Auctions for Makarov barrels, if you are interested.
Also, when you get a Makarov (I highly recommend them) two things:
== Fit and finish will be rough. The East German guns are said to be the best as far as quality of construction, fit and finish and they command a higher price. However, do not let fit and finish scare you away. They are good, inexpensive guns (not "cheap" guns).
== Buy a Pearce brand rubber grip for ~$20 and replace the plastic original grip. You'll be happier with that change. Also, be careful when you mess with the grip screw, because if you make it up too tight, it will impinge on the magazine and can damage it or at least cause the magazine to either not slide in or not slide out properly or at all. So be aware of that issue if you mess with the grip screw.
Wolf.0 -
quote:Originally posted by firedragon1
does Makarov make a 9mm that is NOT a 9x18?, but is a true 9mm? i don't want a 9mm luger 9mm round. i was told this Makarov isa a 9mm Mak and i ask if it was 9x18 and was told no it was 9mm Mak. but, only ammo i can find that says 9mm Makarov shows 9x18 on the box. HELP PLEASE before i buy a weapon maybe i can't find ammo for?
bill
What the others said.
To be clear "Makarov" isn't the name of a company; its the name given to type of pistol designed by a Russian, Nikolai Makarov.
Like many other Russian arms, the Soviets widely exported the design of this pistol, and Makarov pistols were manufactured in many different Communist countries over the years: East Germany, Bulgaria, China, etc. A few of the other Communist bloc countries invented similar guns that are more or less variations on the same using the same 9x18 ammunition (Poland, Czechoslovakia, etc).
Without getting into constipating detail here about all the different varieties of ammo called "9mm" over the years, 9x18 and 9mm Makarov are the same cartridge. Personally I like the term "9mm Makarov" as its fairly unambiguous.
As mentioned, the cartridge is different than the one most Americans know as "9mm", which is more specifically called "9x19mm luger" or "9mm parabellum".
The Makarov cartridge is still in current production, though so far as I know, no American companies make it [Edit, I'm wrong. . .they do, see Jonk below], which means you're not likely to find any on the shelf at a WalMart, Dicks, or other large chain-type store.
Edit: Responding to Jonk below. I don't know why I thought this, probably because I've never seen any for sale in a "normal" store. b But not only do Federal (American Eagle AE9MK) and Winchester make 9x18 rounds, but CCI/Blazer also does too. All three put out more or less standard 95 grain FMJ loads at 1000 fps. Checking quickly, the American brass cased stuff runs about $20 per box, but the Russian steel case is only about $10 a box.
If you can't find any ammo at your local gunstore, you can either mail order it yourself from any number of retailers, or ask the store to order you some. Cost should be similar to any other small auto pistol cartridge, and in some cases, lower, since the Russian made steel-case rounds tend to be relatively inexpensive.
In terms of ballistics, the 9mm Makarov was basically designed to the be most powerful round capable of being fired in a small handgun of simple blowback design. The so called "9mm" bullets it fires are actually a teensy bit wider than 9mm and larger in diameter than the ones used in the 9mm luger round.
The round itself is very slightly more powerful than a .380ACP, which means its somewhat LESS powerful than a typical .38 special snubnose round, and quite a bit less powerful than the "real" 9mm luger round.
Despite what some claim, the .380ACP and 9mm Makarov are marginal rounds. The biggest advantage of this round isn't its power, but rather just that the gun that shoots it is reliable, relatively inexpensive, and easy to conceal.
Here's the ballistic comparison using fairly standard factory loads:
.380 ACP: 95 grain bullet at 950fps; 190 foot-pounds energy.
9mm Makarov: 95 grain bullet at 1000 fps; 210 foot-pounds energy.
.38 special, 2" bbl: 125 grain bullet at 880 fps; 240 ft-lbs energy.
9mm luger: 95 grain bullet at 1300(+) fps, 380 ft-lbs energy.
9mm luger: 115 grain bullet at 1250 fps, 400 ft-lbs energy.
9mm luger: 124 grain bullet at 1150, 380 ft-lbs energy.
Now, you can probably knock off 100 fps from the 9mm luger numbers if you're going to be shooting it from a comparably sized small subcompact pistol. But even so, as you can see from the above data, even the weakest 9mm luger rounds are still a good bit more powerful than any Makarov or .380 round.0 -
In lieu of a Makarov pistol or the Polish designed pistol that shoots the 9x18, there's the CZ 82 available used through wholesalers for GB auctions and sometimes a bit cheaper. The CZ82 has some nice features the Makarov doesn't (ambidextrous safety, a safety that doesn't bind, an easier to use mag release) and a much better trigger. 0 -
The PM45 (Makarov pistol) and the round designed for use in it was designed in 1944-45. The Walther PP Ultra Police - using the 9x18 Super was a post war, early 1950's design - a hybrid of the Walther PP slide with a modified P-38 lower frame. The first 1000 of 5000 or so made, were chambered for the 9mmKurz or 9x17 - the remainder were chambered for the Super round. 0 -
9X18 is 9mm Makarov. Same round. Just like 9X19 is also known as 9mm Luger, 9mm Parabellum, etc.
Beantownshootah- while it is unlikely you will find it on the shelf at wally world, Federal and Winchester both make it. As do a number of foreign companies.0 -
When i bought my makarov it came with a spare barrel,The package says "makarov .380 ACP conversion kit navy arms co.I never installed it so i dont know how it shoots.tks hedge[:D] 0 -
Not a big deal Wolf, but I think you meant to say the Tokarev TT30's and TT33's fired the hot 7.62 x 23, not the 9 x 25
Mauser Export round...those were largely chambered in the Mauser C96 pistol.0
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