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How much value is lost...

53hawkeye
Say you found an early 1900's model Winny. It needs the stock reworked, but not replaced. The price of the firearm is decent (for condition) and falls within appropriate pricing parameters. If redone, is value diminished to the point of it not being worth the investment?
It would be purchased solely for the purpose of reselling at a profit.

Thank you
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Comments

9 comments

Date Votes
  • Bert H.
    Interesting theoretical quandry...

    If you paid what the gun was worth, then refinish the stocks, it is very doubtful that you can sell it for enough to cover the original cost and the added cost of the refinish work. All of that assumes that it is a standard model Winchester. If the gun is a Fancy Sporting Rifle, or some other less common configuration, it could be very easy to recoup your expenses.
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  • rufe-snow
    Thing are really rough now for lots of folks, job(s) wise. Unless you can get it dirt cheap, I wouldn't buy it. There is always a market for collectable firearms like Winchesters, that are factory original, very good condition or better. Anytime that they have been refinished/reworked though, other then by a professional restoration their value drops off precipitously, i.e. only buy it if you can get it cheap and are able to sell it quickly without refinishing the wood or anything else.
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  • beantownshootah
    I'm not sure I understand your question.

    If the gun is a pure investment (ie the only point of you buying it is that you intend to sell it later at maximum profit), then obviously it doesn't make sense to do **ANY** work on it that you believe will decrease its value. Why would you do that?

    To be clear, with very rare exceptions (of maybe replacing worn/damaged/lost parts with authentic originals), generally ANYTHING you do to a collector's gun is going to decrease its overall value. The biggest thing is maintaining original condition.

    If you're asking if its possible for you to do something to the gun that will decrease its intrinsic value, yet still manage to make a profit selling it later. . .sure that's POSSIBLE. The gun could still appreciate in time more than your decrement in value. But just because this could happen, that doesn't make it a sound investment strategy. Again, if your goal is to make the most money possible flipping it, then why do anything that will reduce its value?

    In terms of repair/replacement in general, on first principles most of the time the costs associated with fixing up a gun exceed the increase in value the fix-up adds to the gun.

    In other words, its pretty hard to buy a gun for $500, add $200 worth of work to it, and end up with an $800 gun. More likely, the way the market works, you'll take a $500 gun, add $200 worth of work, and end up with a $600 gun.

    Usually the only way the total will be greater than the sum of the parts is if you acquire the gun for less than its true market price (this can happen if the seller isn't aware of its true value, or simply wants a quick sale), and/or if you have a special ability to fix the gun up cheaply (eg you have your own hot-bluing tank, etc).
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  • RCrosby
    It's early. Some of us haven't had our coffee yet. I think all would agree, since it was mentioned, that one thing you definitely don't want to do is a home re-bluing job; even if you have the tanks and many guns under your belt. Turnbull, yes. The rest of us, NO! (Ref: earlier comments about professional restoration.)
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  • sandwarrior
    53Hawkeye,

    This is the part of collecting I don't agree with. Doing it for money only. If you wanted a fine specimen of a given manufacturer and model and you had the chance to get the basics of it correctly then do so. Of course it would be nicer in totally original and working condition. But if it can't be that then why not go to what represents, authentically, the item you want? As long as what you have is not later on passed off as original. An example of this is many finely restored cars and other pieces of equipment are full of non-original parts. Yet they bring premium prices. And are a joy to own and operate.

    What you seem to have asked is a simple matter of economics. Can I buy X-product at a price I can turn it and sell it for a profit? Yes. If I put money into it and it decreases in value is it then economical? No.

    If you want it for you as an example of what it is, then buy it. And restore it so it looks and works they way it should. Otherwise, you've answered your own question.
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  • beantownshootah
    quote:Originally posted by RCrosby
    It's early. Some of us haven't had our coffee yet. I think all would agree, since it was mentioned, that one thing you definitely don't want to do is a home re-bluing job; even if you have the tanks and many guns under your belt. Turnbull, yes. The rest of us, NO! (Ref: earlier comments about professional restoration.)


    I think I made it clear when I mentioned "home rebluing", that I was speaking in GENERAL, not about trying it on some turn of the century rare classic Winchester, and that ANYTHING you tried to do to a gun like that was likely to decrease its value.

    With respect to Turnbull, though his work and reputation are excellent, I suspect he falls into the usual category of fix up: you're probably going to have to pay him more to work his magic than his restoration will increase the re-sale value of the gun.

    In other words, no matter how nice the gun looks when he's done with it, the process will probably cause a net dollar LOSS to you. As a pure dollar investment, you're probably better off selling the gun as-is, then letting whomever buys it shoulder the costs of a restoration if they want one.

    Of course, like sandwarrior says, pride of ownership and enjoyment in use of a fully restored classic gun may well be worth whatever it costs to do it.

    The analogy to classic cars is pretty apt. People will spend tens of thousands of dollars to drive a rebuilt late 60's Mustang that has poorer handling, acceleration, fuel economy, visibility, and safety than a cheaper brand new 2011 one on the Ford lot!
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  • 53hawkeye
    Thanks for all the learned responses. I place much value in your opinions and you have probably saved me some bucks.
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  • v35
    When you said stock rework needed, what needs to be done and what Winchester model is it?
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  • MBK
    There are 2 Winchester collector and gun show guys called
    Tapaderas Winchesters. They have a weekly newsletter about old Winchesters, and they often discusses values and what counts. But it is about pre-'00 rifles.
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