AR-15 Differance
Has anyone out there had any experance with the Smith & Wesson AR-15. What about the Stag Arms AR-15? I have the old style Colt AR and looking to buy another one in the carbine M4 version. Like to here from someone who has shot them and get the pros and cons on each one.
Hornet
Hornet
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Six in one half dozen in the other. 0 -
Actually the Smith & Wesson M&P15's are awesome and every bit as good as the Colt A15's, although I found that the Colts had inconsistencies that the S&W M&P15's did not, I was shocked as they should have at least been similar and were not.
However don't get me wrong as Colt AR15's are a superb weapon although after looking over several factory new S&W M&P15's and Colt AR15's I found no blemishes with the S&W M&P15's and the fit and finish was better on the S&W M&P15's than on the Colt AR15's as well.
Here are a couple links that review the S&W M&P15 although there are several more including on the major gun forums attesting to the weapons quality:
http://www.gunsandammo.com/content/back-in-black-sws-mp15
http://www.shootingtimes.com/longgun_reviews/swmp15_121906/
I used to be completely devoted to the Colt AR15 as well and had the same opinions until I examined the evidence and talked with numerous experts both military and civilian. Colt has become very inconsistent over the years with their AR15's and has parts made by several different outside contractors as well, that's nothing new.
And to the reviews they are legitimate and I have seen the articles and saw no adds I have also personally checked up on alot of these review articles with suspicion and found them to be accurate as well. It serves no purpose for them to lie as it would be too easy to prove them wrong and once that caught on they would be out of business like any charlatan business.
There are too many positive reviews by legitimate magazines and major forum boards to discredit the S&W M&P15 and anyone that does is just biased against Smith & Wesson. Now again I like Colt almost equally after all of this, but don't appreciate Colt charging me more just for their namesake as that seems crooked especially when they have all those lucrative government contracts.
Smith & Wesson also contends that their product is better than Colt and they stand behind it with a lifetime guarantee to prove it as well as spot on customer service and a lightening quick turn around and shipping. Although I personally have yet to have any problems with any S&W products ever and I have several, nor have I heard of any other S&W M&P15 owners have any repair/warranty issues. However for Colt I can also state that I have never had any issues with their products either except for the slightly rough fit and finish as stated earlier, so apparently Colt has an equal match now with some competition.
Regards
quote:Originally posted by dcs shooters
Take a look at the DPMS M-4. I'll put mine up against any other one made. I have 7 AR,S and the DPMS compares to my Colt-Stags-and Bushmasters [;)]
quote:Originally posted by Mobuck
For at least 75% of the buyers, a blind grab at the rack will get you an AR that will satisfy your needs. I have AR's from 1/2 dozen makers including one from a maker whom everybody disdains and none of them are below average. If you plan on longrange prairie dogs or target use, upgrades are probably useful. For banging away at closer targets on the range, nearly anything is good enough as long as it works most of the time. Combat is a whole different situation but not in the picture right now. My S-I-L did 2 tours in Iraq and claims the plain old M16 is good enough to stake your life on. Functionality was not an issue with their issued rifles which as you know, are made by the lowest bidder. Buy a rifle you can afford, some good mags, and plenty of decent ammo. Learn it's quirks and address any that bother you.
Agreed, good points and I too would put my S&W M&P15's up against any other AR15 type, Colt or otherwise in any environment, place or situation.
Concerning the old M4 Comparison Chart that has been around for a long time I am skeptical as to its accuracy and or credibility and that it may possibly even be biased perhaps but remains ambiguous at best never the less. However I have compared Colt AR15 rifles and parts with Smith & Wesson M&P15 rifles and parts and see no relative differences except for fit and finish which S&W clearly wins. Both the Colt AR15 and S&W M&P15 parts interchange and operate without any problems whatsoever as well and I have also been unable to get either rifle to fail.0 -
I would advise not paying any attention to product reviews in firearms magazines. Never forget they make the majority of their money off advertisements paid for by the very manufacturers whose products they're reviewing.
Dollars to donuts both those issues linked also contain full page S&W rifle advertisements. Ask yourself why they would feel the need to spend those thousands of dollars for an ad in an issue which already contains multiple pages about this product.
As for the quality of the MP15, they're generally good rifles but I'd suggest paying close attention to the specific one you're considering because their internal components are actually produced by other companies. You might luck out, because as an example I've seen some that contained entirely Colt fire control components.
Colt in fact has the most consistent quality of all AR manufacturers. Thhey're the only one where each and every component is manufactured to stringent milspec standards. Others may simply use whatever vendor has the best price on these parts at the time, meaning they have a range of acceptable quality.0 -
Take a look at the DPMS M-4. I'll put mine up against any other one made. I have 7 AR,S and the DPMS compares to my Colt-Stags-and Bushmasters [;)] 0 -
For at least 75% of the buyers, a blind grab at the rack will get you an AR that will satisfy your needs. I have AR's from 1/2 dozen makers including one from a maker whom everybody disdains and none of them are below average. If you plan on longrange prairie dogs or target use, upgrades are probably useful. For banging away at closer targets on the range, nearly anything is good enough as long as it works most of the time. Combat is a whole different situation but not in the picture right now. My S-I-L did 2 tours in Iraq and claims the plain old M16 is good enough to stake your life on. Functionality was not an issue with their issued rifles which as you know, are made by the lowest bidder. Buy a rifle you can afford, some good mags, and plenty of decent ammo. Learn it's quirks and address any that bother you. 0 -
I've got a Smith & Wesson M&P, a piston Stag and a Colt Target Sporter.
With holographic sites, the Smith and the Stag have been 100% and are as accurate as I can point and hold them. They do not have the same feel as the Colt, however. Maybe a bit of nostalgia, maybe just the small amount of extra weight, I don't know, but I would give up either the Stag or S&W before the Colt.0 -
A few things to look for in if you want to make more then a blind grab.
1 Chrome lined chamber and barrel
2 mil spec bolt and carrier
3 mid length gas system
4 factory installed A-frame front sight base
5 4150/(410stainless) or better barrel steel
6 4 or 5 pound match grade single stage trigger
7 plastic delta ring(it makes it easier to free float the barrel later)
8) a vortex flash supressor, or a Noveske three peice flash supressor, if you think you will ever use night vision.0 -
Hornet,
Most any mil-spec rifle you get "off the shelf" in an AR is going to work well for you, if you choose the right configuration. I noted you want one built like an M4. First, to get the short of a barrel you to have a short barrel rifle stamp, $200. So go the extra 1 1/2" and get a barrel that is 16".
Why do you want such a short rifle? Do you want, as quickmajik asked, an A-frame front sight? Do you want a low profile gas block instead? Maybe one with a picatinny on it so you can put a flip-up front sight? or a tri/quad rail where you can mount a flashlight or laser.
In short there are a load of options including some good new calibers in the AR. You need to ask yourself what you want it to do for you.0 -
quote:Originally posted by sandwarrior
Most any mil-spec rifle you get "off the shelf" in an AR is going to work well for you...You're feeding a common misconception that there are numerous makers of milspec AR's.
The term 'milspec' refers to any US military issue item that's been manufactured in accordance with an extensive, detailed technical data package that's developed by the manufacturer as part of the approval process for US military acceptance. This TDP covers every aspect of manufacturing each component of the weapon to insure every unit which is received into our military's inventory is of the exact same quality. Every part, pin and spring of a true milspec firearm has been manufactured in accordance with stringent standards which are insured by DoD inspectors assigned to monitor production.
Colt developed and owns contractural rights to the TDP for the M16. Part of their per unit cost agreement with our military is based upon their retaining exclusive rights to non-US military use of this TDP. In other words, this information can only be released to another US M16 contractor. FN and Sabre are currently the only other manufacturers who produce M16's for our military and due to this contract of Colt's are not allowed to market these rifles to the public.
When you see any other AR manufacturer describing their rifle as milspec it's a marketing ploy. In truth their rifles only contain some components bought from subcontractors who manufacture these in accordance with the TDP for government issue rifles. In some cases you'll even see AR's described as milspec that actually contain only a couple of parts produced in accordance with the TDP. Buyer beware.
The bottom line is that the only milspec AR that can be purchased by the public is the Colt. The question the buyer has to ask themselves is whether their needs call for milspec quality.0
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