NRA HQ Response
Relating to the lies about the NRA "sellling out" by working with Democrats and supporting more restrictions on the 1st Amendment (and by extension, the 2A) Here is the official response from the NRA. The fair and reasonable people here may find it interesting and helpful. The usual NRA haters will continue to hate.
We appreciate some NRA members' concerns about our position on H.R. 5175, the "DISCLOSE Act." Unfortunately, critics of our position have misstated or misunderstood the facts.
We have never said we would support any version of this bill. To the contrary, we clearly stated NRA's strong opposition to the DISCLOSE Act (as introduced) in a letter sent to Members of Congress on May 26 (click here to read the letter).
Through the courts and in Congress, the NRA has consistently and strongly opposed any effort to restrict the rights of our four million members to speak and have their voices heard on behalf of gun owners nationwide. The initial version of H.R. 5175 would effectively have put a gag order on the NRA during elections and threatened our members' freedom of association, by forcing us to turn our donor lists over to the federal government. We would also have been forced to list our top donors on all election-related television, radio and Internet ads and mailings-even mailings to our own members. We refuse to let this Congress impose those unconstitutional restrictions on our Association.
The NRA provides critical firearms training for our Armed Forces and law enforcement throughout the country. This bill would force us to choose between training our men and women in uniform and exercising our right to free political speech. We refuse to let this Congress force us to make that choice.
We didn't "sell out" to Nancy Pelosi or anyone else. We told Congress we opposed the bill. As a result, congressional leaders made a commitment to exempt us from its draconian restrictions on free speech. If that commitment is honored, we will not be involved in the final House debate. If that commitment is not fully honored, we will strongly oppose the bill.
Our position is based on principle and experience. During consideration of the previous campaign finance legislation passed in 2002, congressional leadership repeatedly refused to exempt the NRA from its provisions, promising that our concerns would be fixed somewhere down the line. That didn't happen; instead, the NRA had to live under those restrictions for seven years and spend millions of dollars on compliance costs and on legal fees to challenge the law. We will not go down that road again when we have an opportunity to protect our ability to speak.
There are those who say the NRA has a greater duty to principle than to gun rights. It's easy to say we should put the Second Amendment at risk over some so-called First Amendment principle - unless you have a sworn duty to protect the Second Amendment above all else, as we do.
The NRA is a bipartisan, single-issue organization made up of millions of individual members dedicated to the protection of the Second Amendment. We do not represent the interests of other organizations. That's their responsibility. Our responsibility is to protect and defend the interests of our members. And that we do without apology.
We appreciate some NRA members' concerns about our position on H.R. 5175, the "DISCLOSE Act." Unfortunately, critics of our position have misstated or misunderstood the facts.
We have never said we would support any version of this bill. To the contrary, we clearly stated NRA's strong opposition to the DISCLOSE Act (as introduced) in a letter sent to Members of Congress on May 26 (click here to read the letter).
Through the courts and in Congress, the NRA has consistently and strongly opposed any effort to restrict the rights of our four million members to speak and have their voices heard on behalf of gun owners nationwide. The initial version of H.R. 5175 would effectively have put a gag order on the NRA during elections and threatened our members' freedom of association, by forcing us to turn our donor lists over to the federal government. We would also have been forced to list our top donors on all election-related television, radio and Internet ads and mailings-even mailings to our own members. We refuse to let this Congress impose those unconstitutional restrictions on our Association.
The NRA provides critical firearms training for our Armed Forces and law enforcement throughout the country. This bill would force us to choose between training our men and women in uniform and exercising our right to free political speech. We refuse to let this Congress force us to make that choice.
We didn't "sell out" to Nancy Pelosi or anyone else. We told Congress we opposed the bill. As a result, congressional leaders made a commitment to exempt us from its draconian restrictions on free speech. If that commitment is honored, we will not be involved in the final House debate. If that commitment is not fully honored, we will strongly oppose the bill.
Our position is based on principle and experience. During consideration of the previous campaign finance legislation passed in 2002, congressional leadership repeatedly refused to exempt the NRA from its provisions, promising that our concerns would be fixed somewhere down the line. That didn't happen; instead, the NRA had to live under those restrictions for seven years and spend millions of dollars on compliance costs and on legal fees to challenge the law. We will not go down that road again when we have an opportunity to protect our ability to speak.
There are those who say the NRA has a greater duty to principle than to gun rights. It's easy to say we should put the Second Amendment at risk over some so-called First Amendment principle - unless you have a sworn duty to protect the Second Amendment above all else, as we do.
The NRA is a bipartisan, single-issue organization made up of millions of individual members dedicated to the protection of the Second Amendment. We do not represent the interests of other organizations. That's their responsibility. Our responsibility is to protect and defend the interests of our members. And that we do without apology.
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quote:Originally posted by wsfiredude
quote:Originally posted by quickmajik
quote:Originally posted by quickmajik
quote:Originally posted by wsfiredudeOriginally posted by tr fox
We told Congress we opposed the bill. As a result, congressional leaders made a commitment to exempt us from its draconian restrictions on free speech.
BALONEY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That isnt what they told me...The ILA said they were still holding out to see the language before the figured out if they would oppose it, or, pretend they had nothing to do with the process.
Arent they going to back harry reid in november because of this exemption?
Despite the fact he has been on the records many times a an anti gunner?
Imagine that.. They are backing the guy who would be joyfully heading up any anti gun legislation in the senate, if he gets re-elected.. I wonder if they are gonna get a big tax break or something a year or two down the line, as well as selling all other gun orgs membership privacy down the commode.
Quick,
I am not suggesting it didn't happen, but I do not think the deal was as simple as the NRA makes it out to be;
"We told Congress we opposed the bill. As a result, congressional leaders made a commitment to exempt us..."
In their statement, the NRA implies they simply walked up the hill and told Congress, "No; we do not like it.", then Congress bowed. I do not believe that for a second.
I guarantee there was a NRA 'masseuse' behind the scenes, giving 'back rubs' and g-d knows what else to coerce Congress into granting the exemption.
They spent over two million dollars to get the supreme court to decide the way they did on the case that brought about the whole thing..[;)]0 -
Don
They are all we have right now. I'm sure you are a man that is intelligent enough to see that. Look at your business and see all the comprises you and everyone in it has to make on a daily basis. A person that sees every thing in black and white won't go far and if you reach way down and think I'm sure you can see there are other colors.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rosie
Don
They are all we have right now. I'm sure you are a man that is intelligent enough to see that. Look at your business and see all the comprises you and everyone in it has to make on a daily basis. A person that sees every thing in black and white won't go far and if you reach way down and think I'm sure you can see there are other colors.
LMAO!
You were not really serious with that response, were you?0 -
quote:A person that sees every thing in black and white won't go far and if you reach way down and think I'm sure you can see there are other colors.
That apply to YOUR Honor and integrity, also, Rosie ?0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rosie
Don
They are all we have right now. I'm sure you are a man that is intelligent enough to see that. Look at your business and see all the comprises you and everyone in it has to make on a daily basis. A person that sees every thing in black and white won't go far and if you reach way down and think I'm sure you can see there are other colors.
Compromise such as you describe in business is fine and acceptable in many instances.
Of course, when talking about the Constitution, it is a completely different equation and there is NO compromise to be made unless it is via the Amendment Process which is found in, you guessed it, the Constitution itself.
You guys either cannot or simply refuse to see any distinction between private business dealings which are yours to make between private individuals and the already established 'contract' between the States, the People and the Federal Government, which is the US Constitution.
Frankly, you are simply beyond help in my opinion and after seeing you express such views over the years.
You are the poster-boy for an eroded Constitution, vanishing individual liberty, vanishing state and national sovereignty and a burgeoning predatory federal government.0 -
All of this crap don't mean diddly squat anymore.
The poop storm is coming and you better hold your arms close !0 -
Yeah, Forester... just sure fun, kicking these Beast-Lovers around, is all....I have decided that I am gonna have fun till it all ends in a bang.... 0 -
Good for you Highball !
Give 'em HELL.
Make 'em eat plenty of Rollaids !0 -
quote:Originally posted by nyforester
All of this crap don't mean diddly squat anymore.
The poop storm is coming and you better hold your arms close !
Good to see you post forester. How ya been?0 -
Jeff
I have been here, just reading and watching.
I have been real busy. I opened up a side Forestry business
that has been taking up most of my weekends and evenings.
Can't complain, the money is GOOD !
Thanks,
Pete0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rosie
Don
They are all we have right now. I'm sure you are a man that is intelligent enough to see that. Look at your business and see all the comprises you and everyone in it has to make on a daily basis. A person that sees every thing in black and white won't go far and if you reach way down and think I'm sure you can see there are other colors.
Rosie:
They are not all that we have right now.
The Cato Institute led the charge for Keller over the objection of the NRA.
The Cato Institute led the charge for McDonald and, IMO, presented properly using Privileges and Immunities. The NRA shouldered their way in after the SCOTUS accepted the case and was hell-bent on watering it down using Due Process, ensuring that 'reasonable' licensing, registration, and regulation (read restrictions) can be implemented.
Cato's lawyer in both these cases is closely tied to the GOA.
The 2nd Amendment Foundation has done yeoman's work in a number of cases up and down the west coast, some of which the NRA has signed onto after the fact and claimed credit.
In all these cases, the goal (not necessarily the result, I admit) has been the elimination of restriction, not the substitution of a softer restriction. This is the uncompromised approach. While it is true that the end result is often compromised by the courts, it is inevitably less compromised when a plaintiff begins from an uncompromised position.
In business, I do have to compromise at times. We never, however, compromise our principles. We turned down work in pre Desert Storm Iraq because we had no interest in blood money. We have (and will continue to) no-bid contracts in Saudi because we are morally opposed to that regime.
My personal opposition to the NRA as a 2nd Amendment organization is that they have participated in the re-definition of the 2nd to a statement of Hunting, Self-protection, and Sporting rights. They specifically ignore the actual reason, as it ruffles the feathers of their friends in Congress and a large portion of their membership.
If they wish to re-cast themselves as a hunting rights group, a shooting sports rights group, and/or a personal protection rights group, I would have no problem with them. It is unconscionable in my mind, however, to support a group that has assumed the mantel of a 2nd Amendment Rights group when they support legislation that is contrary.0 -
Highball you may be having fun THINKING you can kick me around but truth of the matter is you are not smart enough to even come close. As for 496 this is the kind of policeman I want to protect me? I think not. He is just like you and some others Highball. If you don't think the way he thinks you are wrong. I have as much right to my opinion as as you and anyone else.
THE CONSTITUTION SAYS SO!!
Look at the first amendment. Read it out loud. Now read it again. About 98 more times may get it to sink in but I doubt it. You know it could be that I should be scared highball. You see Hitler wasn't a real smart man but he got a few misguided souls to run around doing back flips and panting like puppies to follow him, (all you highball followers insert your name here) and they grew into a crowd, then a mob and pretty soon they were big enough to take over a whole country. Being sadistic and wanting to see blood flow they started killing. Before they were stopped many many millions of people were killed. Yes I should be scared but for some reason I'm not. So keep calling me names Highball if it makes you feel like a big man. To me it has the opposite effect.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rosie
Highball you may be having fun THINKING you can kick me around but truth of the matter is you are not smart enough to even come close. As for 496 this is the kind of policeman I want to protect me? I think not. He is just like you and some others Highball. If you don't think the way he thinks you are wrong. I have as much right to my opinion as as you and anyone else.
THE CONSTITUTION SAYS SO!!
Look at the first amendment. Read it out loud. Now read it again. About 98 more times may get it to sink in but I doubt it. You know it could be that I should be scared highball. You see Hitler wasn't a real smart man but he got a few misguided souls to run around doing back flips and panting like puppies to follow him, (all you highball followers insert your name here) and they grew into a crowd, then a mob and pretty soon they were big enough to take over a whole country. Being sadistic and wanting to see blood flow they started killing. Before they were stopped many many millions of people were killed. Yes I should be scared but for some reason I'm not. So keep calling me names Highball if it makes you feel like a big man. To me it has the opposite effect.
Here it is, in a simple form (if you can understand), why I can't stand your kind......
You HAVE the right to your OPINION. You DON'T have the RIGHT to TRAMPLE MY LIBERTIES. Neither by your own efforts, nor by proxy. IF you support the NRA, you support the destruction of the constitution. You ARE an ENEMY of the country. Your kind are no differnt that the progressives that seek to destroy our nation. You are ALL doing your part to assure the destrution of this nation.
There is an AMENDMENT process to CHANGE the constitution. Yellowbellies can't stand the fight of it. Instead of being OPEN and forthright, your type chooses to slink like a SNAKE in the grass.0 -
There you go, Rosie.
A Free Man spoke his piece..Freemind explained very well how very wrong you are.
Just to emphasis...the Bill of Rights are NOT OPINIONS...they are Rights accorded me by God. People like you DON'T GET TO CHANGE THEM..without going thru the process.
It is YOU AND YOURS that are emulating Hitler...not I.0 -
No. All he said was if I didn't agree with him I am wrong. Thats the same thing you have been saying all along. Damn those puppies are loud! [:D][^] 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rosie
No. All he said was if I didn't agree with him I am wrong. Thats the same thing you have been saying all along. Damn those puppies are loud! [:D][^]
Reading comprehension a lacking skill for you eh?
Oh well, you are a NRA supporter/cheerleader. It is what I have come to expect from you. Oh well. It is your grandkids that you choose to enslave with your "opinions". Maybe they will get an extra helping of soylent green someday.....0 -
I don't give a thin dasnm if ANYBODY agree with me. I desire for them to agree that the Constitution..specifically, the Bill of Rights...MEANS WHAT IT SAYS !!
You are PERFECTLY welcome to disagree with the ideology of it...just as I am free to call you what you are for doing so.0 -
But Highball! I wanna be on the winning side!
That ought to keep your old heart pumping for a week or two. If it starts to beat slow start another anti NRA thread and I will jump right in. [:D]
I AM THE NRA!0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rosie
But Highball! I wanna be on the winning side!
That ought to keep your old heart pumping for a week or two. If it starts to beat slow start another anti NRA thread and I will jump right in. [:D]
I AM THE Not Rational At all!
Yep, you certainly are, Rosie.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rosie
No. All he said was if I didn't agree with him I am wrong. Thats the same thing you have been saying all along. Damn those puppies are loud! [:D][^]
Damn, are you deaf *******?0 -
Here's how it breaks down for me:
Either it's bad for us or it isn't. If it's bad and the NRA thinks so, why did they settle for an "exemption"? And it they are exempt, why aren't all of us?
This is why I'm never a life member of any organization like the NRA. This is also my personal tipping point with the NRA. It stinks to high heaven, in my opinion, and I'm done with them.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Colonel Plink
Here's how it breaks down for me:
Either it's bad for us or it isn't. If it's bad and the NRA thinks so, why did they settle for an "exemption"? And it they are exempt, why aren't all of us?
This is why I'm never a life member of any organization like the NRA. This is also my personal tipping point with the NRA. It stinks to high heaven, in my opinion, and I'm done with them.
Well-reasoned and appropriate.
Welcome to NRA enlightenment, Colonel.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Colonel Plink
This is also my personal tipping point with the NRA. It stinks to high heaven, in my opinion, and I'm done with them.
I will echo lt496.
Welcome aboard. [;)]0 -
quote:Originally posted by nyforester
All of this crap don't mean diddly squat anymore.
The poop storm is coming and you better hold your arms close !
Great to see you post Forester!! Glad your business is taking hold, and your post is spot on BTW.0
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