Model 70 Bolt/Extractor Problem...continued
quote:Originally posted by v35
Sorry,I don't buy it.
If one Pre 64 Mod 70 will feed singles outside of the magazine than it's safe to say others can also be easily made to do it as military rifles are. If I'm wrong,which I doubt, you buy another extractor.
Any military rifle pistol or SMG and the BAR should take rounds singly. Try it with your Mausers, Japs, Swedes etc. I'd like to hear of any 20th century exceptions.
Incidentally, scope mounted military bolt actions can't take stripper clips.
You can't count on what form ammo will come in in combat.
One may even have to delink 30 cal belts or find rounds loose in boxes and not find it in the nice form you'd like it when you need it.
I'd like to know the basis of the urban legend that Mauser based rifles having positive feed extractors must be fed from a stripper clip or worked through a magazine or the extractor will break.
Even pistols will accept single feed including the 1911 and Beretta which purposely has the open top slide to do so. Here again, I'd like to know of any exceptions.
I doubt any military board would accept such a handicapped rifle.
My 96 Swede just fed singles dropped into the chamber, effortlessly.
Thank you very much for the reply. I agree. It should load loose rounds without trouble, like my other Model 70 does. I would get a different extractor for it but,i tried the bolt out of my 7mm in it and it did the same thing, exactly. That is why I was curious if I could remove some material from the extractor to give it proper clearance. It would be in the thickest part of the extractor. Otherwise, one would have to alter the receiver to gain clearance...thoughts??
Sorry,I don't buy it.
If one Pre 64 Mod 70 will feed singles outside of the magazine than it's safe to say others can also be easily made to do it as military rifles are. If I'm wrong,which I doubt, you buy another extractor.
Any military rifle pistol or SMG and the BAR should take rounds singly. Try it with your Mausers, Japs, Swedes etc. I'd like to hear of any 20th century exceptions.
Incidentally, scope mounted military bolt actions can't take stripper clips.
You can't count on what form ammo will come in in combat.
One may even have to delink 30 cal belts or find rounds loose in boxes and not find it in the nice form you'd like it when you need it.
I'd like to know the basis of the urban legend that Mauser based rifles having positive feed extractors must be fed from a stripper clip or worked through a magazine or the extractor will break.
Even pistols will accept single feed including the 1911 and Beretta which purposely has the open top slide to do so. Here again, I'd like to know of any exceptions.
I doubt any military board would accept such a handicapped rifle.
My 96 Swede just fed singles dropped into the chamber, effortlessly.
Thank you very much for the reply. I agree. It should load loose rounds without trouble, like my other Model 70 does. I would get a different extractor for it but,i tried the bolt out of my 7mm in it and it did the same thing, exactly. That is why I was curious if I could remove some material from the extractor to give it proper clearance. It would be in the thickest part of the extractor. Otherwise, one would have to alter the receiver to gain clearance...thoughts??
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tatasta: Re-read tsr1965's s replies! They are absolutely correct.
I have seen this written several times and when I find one written by a manufacturer I'll send it to you.
If you're hunting with a full magazine and think you'd want an extra round,- 4 shots instead of 3, and pop in a single on top of a mag full,- it'll jam the round into the chamber and won't extract it. The extractor is not designed to go over the rim! As the bolt is pushed forward the round slides up the front of the bolt and under the extractor. No jams this way. It's not my idea, it's the makers.
Some are made to work the other way, but not the Mauser types.0 -
Yes, work on the thickest part, only removing metal where blackening is rubbed off plus a little extra to allow for an eccentric rim from reloaded brass.
Polish and round the front of the claw so it will ride over the rims easily. Don't thin it unnecessarily.
I recall polishing a roughly made, scope mounted Jap to work more easily when loading singly. It wasn't all that smooth but it worked without breakage or bending.
It won't work on a Manlicher Steyr because it hasn't the long Mauser spring extractor, besides, that's not a military rifle.
Bolt actions for dangerous game should permit single loading as we've discussed. A round jammed in a chamber in front of an unyielding extractor could spoil one's afternoon.
Much is made about the superiority of controlled feed over push feed.
So much so that Winchester acquiesced to the demand and is again producing the original Model 70 controlled feed.
It's too bad the armies of the world are so blind as to have abandoned the Mauser controlled feed extractor in small arms.
The Swedish Mauser loads singly just as slick as you please.0 -
For Everyone,
Here is the directions, directly from the owner's/operator's manual.
quote:Notice ! When loading a cartridge directly into
the chamber (bypassing the magazine) you will
experience a slight to substantial increase
in resistance as the bolt is rotated to the
lock ed position, and the extractor clears the
cartridge rim.
Single-Shot Load ing
If you wish to use your Model 70 as a single-shot rifle, it
is recommended that you use the following single-shot
loading procedure.
1. With the "safety" in the intermediate position, lift the
bolt handle and pull the bolt back all the way.
2. Lay a cartridge in the action just forward of the bolt.
Press the cartridge down with your thumb until it
snaps into the magazine (Figure 13).
3. When ready to shoot, close the bolt to load the single
cartridge from the magazine into the chamber.
Best0 -
tatasta,
The Mauser system, including the Winchester M70 with the claw extractor, loads from the magazine. This is fact, not supposition or some wonderment. This has gone on long enough especially when the facts are in evidence.
Enough is enough.
Load your rifle from the magazine or risk breaking the extractor or jamming a cartridge in the chamber, your choice.
We're done here.
Best.0
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