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AR supressor ???'s

Spartacus
If one was to use a full length/over the barrel suppressor on a 20" AR 5.56,
how much and where on the barrel would you port the barrel?
there was a british rifle with an over barrel can in WW2 that was nearly silent, or so i'm told.
is there a spec sheet on it somewhere?
thanks!
tom
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10 comments

Date Votes
  • iwannausername
    The Brit rifle was the DeLisle carbine - an Enfield converted to 45acp and then suppressed.

    Rhineland Arms used to make a kit to convert mausers (small and large ring) or Enfields to this config, using a 1911 mag.



    quote:Originally posted by tplumeri
    If one was to use a full length/over the barrel suppressor on a 20" AR 5.56,
    how much and where on the barrel would you port the barrel?
    there was a british rifle with an over barrel can in WW2 that was nearly silent, or so i'm told.
    is there a spec sheet on it somewhere?
    thanks!
    tom
    0
  • Nwcid
    Not sure quite what you are asking for.

    To be quite a gun needs 2 things, reduced/removed muzzle blast (what a silencer does) AND a bullet traveling at subsonic speeds. Even with very short barrels (>6") .223 is still super sonic. So unless I am misunderstanding what you are wanting to do, it will not work.

    As stated the DeLisle was in .45 ACP which is a SS round in the first place.
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  • nononsense
    tplumeri,

    This is an article I have marked for reference regarding the Delisle:

    http://www.rifleman.org.uk/The_DeLisle_carbine.htm

    It is complete with drawings.

    A newly manufactured version:

    http://www.valkyriearms.com/delisle.htm

    This website has a section on silenced firearms and contains some good references. There are several good drawings also. Be sure to search the site not just this section:

    http://www.guns.connect.fi/gow/QA1.html

    Best.
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  • Spartacus
    quote:AND a bullet traveling at subsonic speeds

    yeah, i forgot about that. i guess i'll have to get another barrel for the 9mm colt to experiment on.

    hey nononsense, great sites! thanks!
    tom
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  • Nwcid
    quote:Originally posted by tplumeri
    quote:AND a bullet traveling at subsonic speeds

    yeah, i forgot about that. i guess i'll have to get another barrel for the 9mm colt to experiment on.



    I guess a better question would be what exactly is it you are trying to do? There are SS loadings for the .223 but wont cycle the action and have the ballistics of .22.

    THere are also several other loadings for the AR that are SS like the Whisper family. I have an AR in .300 Whisper.
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  • Spartacus
    quote:I have an AR in .300 Whisper.

    i'm embarrassed to admit it, but i've never heard of the .300 whisper.
    guess it's off to google it ........

    quote: what exactly is it you are trying to do?

    someone told me the Delisle (didn't know the name at the time)had a full length can, and could hardly be heard when fired. how it would be ported and the internals of the can etc got me curious. Now i just want to see how silent i can make one.
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  • 11b6r
    Have shot a DeLisle once. Does make a noise- the firing pin goes CLICK. Barrels were from Thompson SMGs. Still a limited range special purpose weapon.
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  • Nwcid
    quote:Originally posted by tplumeri
    quote:I have an AR in .300 Whisper.

    i'm embarrassed to admit it, but i've never heard of the .300 whisper.
    guess it's off to google it ........

    quote: what exactly is it you are trying to do?

    someone told me the Delisle (didn't know the name at the time)had a full length can, and could hardly be heard when fired. how it would be ported and the internals of the can etc got me curious. Now i just want to see how silent i can make one.



    Some integral silencers use ported barrels and this is normally done to reduce normal speed (super sonic) rounds to subsonic speeds (no crack noise from breaking the speed of sound). Probably the most common current use of this kind of system is the MP5SD.

    For the quietest gun use a long barrel .22 with SS ammo in a gun with a locked action (bolt/lever/single/ect). The long barrel will make sure the powder is all burned, SS will make sure there is no "crack" and a locked action will mean no action noise or pressure coming from the ejection port.

    A great example is a suppressed 77/22. The noise of firing is about the same as taking the safety off. The noise of bullet impact is WAY louder then the shot,

    (top gun)
    DSC06840.jpg

    Not that this pic does not show much but the AR is a 9mm with a 6.5" barrel that is ported in the manner you speak of. It still requires the use of SS ammo though. It is a semi custom build I had done since SBR is not allowed in my state or I would not have done it.

    Sound on the AR is slightly louder then on the Glock due to action noise (or maybe the fact it is right next to your ear. Still quite but not as quiet as the .22 lr.

    DSC_0010.jpg


    quote:someone told me the Delisle (didn't know the name at the time)had a full length can, and could hardly be heard when fired. how it would be ported and the internals of the can etc got me curious. Now i just want to see how silent i can make one.



    Again I have to ask what you are trying to do. Or I guess better to the point how quiet you can make what? What does "one" mean, is it a caliber, a gun, a action, a.........

    .22 is stupid quiet. Any SS round is very quiet. Any supersonic round still has a crack to it but the muzzle blast will be much less.

    In theory larger cans will reduce muzzle blast more but at a certain point there is no advantage. With better baffles and designs smaller silencers can work as well as larger ones.
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  • Spartacus
    quote: Again I have to ask what you are trying to do

    the initial idea was to see how quiet i could make a .223 AR. when you reminded me about subsonic, i decided to see what i could do with a 9mm AR. ie how quiet could i make "one".
    I already have a "factory' can screwed on the end of the 9mm colt AR. It's quiet, but definitely not "all you hear is a click" quiet. I'm sure i could get someone to build a barrel/suppressor to do the job, but the engineer in me wants to understand the process AND get my hands dirty.[:D]
    btw, those are great looking guns! thanks for posting the pics!
    tom
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  • Nwcid
    quote:Originally posted by tplumeri
    quote: Again I have to ask what you are trying to do

    the initial idea was to see how quiet i could make a .223 AR. when you reminded me about subsonic, i decided to see what i could do with a 9mm AR. ie how quiet could i make "one".
    I already have a "factory' can screwed on the end of the 9mm colt AR. It's quiet, but definitely not "all you hear is a click" quiet. I'm sure i could get someone to build a barrel/suppressor to do the job, but the engineer in me wants to understand the process AND get my hands dirty.[:D]
    btw, those are great looking guns! thanks for posting the pics!
    tom


    Ok, I think I am caught up now [:D]

    Unless you have a really crappy silencer now I dont think you will see much reduction in sound. The majority of your noise issue is going to be the action noise. The only way to reduce this noise is with some kind of locked action.

    If you want to look at silencers from the engineering stand point here is a good site for you, http://www.silencertalk.com/ You will have to to register to read much.
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