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Need help with a couple of antiques...

TheBishop
My father passed away yesterday. In going through his things, I stumbled across two old guns that he got from my grandfather, but never really told me anything about. I was hoping you folks might be able to fill in some blanks for me.

The first is an Iver Johnson #28844 stamped under the trigger guard. The only other mark is under the butt and reads: "Pat. Nov 17, 08" and under that "pats pending"

The second is a Gold Hibbard double barrel shotgun. On one of the barrels, the stamp reads "choke bore." On the underside of the stock, there is a badge shaped inlay. I can't find any other discernable markings.

I am interested to try to place these pieces historically. I am not really sure if I intend to sell them or not because they obviously held some value to our family, but I would like to know their story. I guess I should have asked long ago.

Thanks for an help you can give.
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Comments

9 comments

Date Votes
  • duckhunter
    Need more info. Pics will help.
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  • b.goforth
    the iver johnson is a third model (nov.17.08 patent date). the main serial number location is on the left side of the grip frame. this is the only location that will have a letter code. the letter code is what is needed to correctly date this revolver.

    bill
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  • Ned Fall
    I figured Bill Goforth would respond to the Iver Johnson question (and do a better job of it than I could) so I'll limit my response to the GOLD HIBBARD gun. Actucaly there were two shotguns with this name and both were made in Belgium. One is just GOLD HIBBARD and the other is GOLD HIBBARD MODIFIED DIANA. Both are "Trade Brand Name" shotguns. A "Trade Brand Name" shotgun is one made by a major maker for and sold by a wholesaler or retailer who chose the name to go on the gun. The Gold Hibbard was made by Neumann Freres (Brothers) in 1910 only and I suspect imported by H & D Folsome, a large wholesale and retail sporting goods dealer located in New York City for and was sold by the Hibbard, Spencer, BartlettCo a wholesale sporting goods dealer located in Chicago.IL. The Gold Hibbard Modified Diana was made by Henri Pieper another Belgian maker. Sorry but no date information available but it would have been made sometime early in the 20th century.The same importer and seller applies. Value? The value of these old shotguns depends on their condition, the amount of original finish remaining on the metal and wood as well as the mechanical condition. Values can range from about $175 for one in factory new condition to less than $10 for a rusty rotten incomplete piece of junk fit only for a tomato stake. CAUTION! The old Belgian made guns were designed for the ammunition in use at the time which was either black powder or very early low pressure smokeless powder. They also will have damascus barrels and 2 9/16 inch chambers. They were not designed for more modern high pressure smokeless powder, 3 inch or magnum shells or steel shot. My recommendation is DON"T ATTEMPT TO SHOOT IT!
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  • TheBishop
    THanks, guys. The stamp under the grip on the Iver Johnson is G28844.

    As for shooting, I don't intend to fire either of these guns.
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  • TheBishop
    Oh, and on the Gold Hibbard, is the badge inlay indicative of anything? I wasn't sure if this was a law-enforcement issue or anything like that.
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  • b.goforth
    small frame iver johnson's arms & cycle works safety automatic hammer revolver serial number G 28844 was manufactured in 1917, there were 9,000 of this model manufactured that year.

    THIRD MODEL SAFETY AUTOMATIC HAMMER REVOLVER
    (Smokeless Powder Cartridges)
    1909-1941
    LARGE FRAME AND SMALL FRAME VERSIONS USES HAMMER THE HAMMER ACTION: Double top post barrel latch with Hammer the Hammer action. This model redesigned to be strong enough for smokeless powder. All coil springs, hard rubber grip panels with Owls head at top, optional oversize grips of hard rubber or wood were offered. Two frame sizes, four calibers, Standard barrel length: small frame 3 inches, large frame 3 ? inches. Calibers: small frame .22 rimfire 7 rounds cylinder capacity, .32 centerfire 5 rounds cylinder capacity, large frame .32 Special centerfire with 6 rounds cylinder capacity, .38 centerfire with 5 rounds cylinder capacity; Weight: small frame .22 rimfire with 3 inch barrel 13 ounces, .32 centerfire with 3 inch barrel 13 ? ounces, large frame with 3 ? inch barrel .32 Special 19 ounces, .38 centerfire with 3 ? inch barrel 18 ? inches; Height: small frame 3 _ inches, large frame 3 7/8 inches; Frame length: small frame 4 3/16 inches, large frame 5 inches; Overall length: small frame with 3 inch barrel 6 3/8 inches, large frame with 3 ? inch barrel 7 3/8 inches. Main serial number location on left side of grip frame grips must be removed to see. The Third Model features a double top post barrel latch, coil hammer spring and four cross pins in the lower frame.
    VALUE: 100%=$250 60%=$115
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  • Ned Fall
    The small badge shaped inlay is merely decoration.
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  • v35
    I believe these nickel silver inlays were to engrave the owner's initials on.
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  • TheBishop
    Thanks to all, you have been very helpful. I really do appreciate it.
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