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Mannlicher-Schoenauer M1900

MSM1900
I have asked this on a couple of boards with no responses.. I see that Joel_Black and others on here are knowledgeable on these guns so i thought i would throw it out there one more place and hope for the best. I have researched this thing for 8 hours and the closest i have come is to find an old "Rifle Magazine" from 1992 that had mention of someone owning this firearm and it was referenced by the author as the only one he has ever seen..

Gun was brought back from WW2 by my grandfather and is a M-S M1900 rifle. With it were 3 boxes of 6.5x54ms ammo..

would the serial# be 355?
would the date of manufacture be between 1900-1903?

Can anyone tell me anything about the M1900 (i have seen rumors of only 1000 made), as well as approx value? It looks to be a historic gun with as little info about them is out there.. I looked at all the firearms value books, and none mention the M1900..

I would appreciate any help of info that can be shared!

(it didn't work to copy/paste my clickable thumbnails in here, so the links below are in order for the thumbnails from left to right)
th_P2201311.jpgth_P2201312.jpgth_P2201313.jpgth_P2201314.jpgth_P2201315.jpgth_P2201316.jpg

http://s205.photobucket.com/albums/bb286/ebodykid/mannlicher/?action=view&current=P2201311.jpg
http://s205.photobucket.com/albums/bb286/ebodykid/mannlicher/?action=view&current=P2201312.jpg
http://s205.photobucket.com/albums/bb286/ebodykid/mannlicher/?action=view&current=P2201313.jpg
http://s205.photobucket.com/albums/bb286/ebodykid/mannlicher/?action=view&current=P2201314.jpg
http://s205.photobucket.com/albums/bb286/ebodykid/mannlicher/?action=view&current=P2201315.jpg
http://s205.photobucket.com/albums/bb286/ebodykid/mannlicher/?action=view&current=P2201316.jpg
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Comments

10 comments

Date Votes
  • nononsense
    MSM1900,

    Welcome to the Gunbroker Forums!

    Let's see if this helps with the size...


    P2201311.jpg

    P2201312.jpg

    P2201313.jpg

    P2201314.jpg

    P2201315.jpg

    P2201316.jpg

    Maybe a bit too big for the forums but better for detail.

    Best.
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  • rufe-snow
    Although Black doesn't agree with this, my information is that these rifles were made for the Portuguese military, for test purposes. After the Portuguese decided that the Vergueiro made by Mauser was going to be their standard military rifle, the M-S's were sold on the surplus market to various European gunsmiths who reworked them for commercial sale.

    The stippled receiver ring is commonly found on reworked military rifles in Europe. it's how European gunsmiths disguised the original military markings.
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  • MSM1900
    Thanks for the reply.. so is the 355 the serial number on this gun? The things that i find odd on this gun are the dual trigger (so it should be european and not british) and that it has the butterknife bolt style. Most mention of the M1900 were that they had a more standard bolt.
    http://www.riflemagazine.com/magazine/PDF/ri142partial.pdf (page 27) also talks briefly about a M1900 and describes the stippling identical to my gun.

    Any idea on value ranges for a gun like this? I see mention of sales of M1903's but no M1900's. Also, i have seen mention of 1000 of these exist? Is that correct (to the best of peoples knowledge)?

    also, any idea on what the 2.49 G.B.P on the gun might mean?

    thanks!
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  • nononsense
    MSM1900,

    This is a reference to the powder charge:

    Gewehr Bl?ttchen Pulver (military flake powder)

    2.49 is the amount in grams.

    Best.
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  • rufe-snow
    I believe that 1000 rifles were originally made for the Portuguese trials. It's doubtful that after 110 years there are many still left in circulation. Since the rifle has been so radically sporterized from it's original military configuration it wouldn't have any value to a collector of military rifles. Check out on-line what the military Greek M-S's looked like, to get a idea of what the original Portuguese test trials rifles were. Your has been worked over extensively.
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  • MSM1900
    I appreciate the info so far.. Like i had said before, i am scouring the web for info on these, and am starting to put together some of the pieces. Since the M1900 was first introduced at the world fair (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mannlicher-Schönauer) and not yet necessarily destined as a portuguese military trial model, is it possible that this was instead a non-military firearm to begin with? Once again, i appreciate the info in helping to piece the history of this gun together! You have all been greatly knowledgeable!
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  • rufe-snow
    quote:Originally posted by MSM1900
    I appreciate the info so far.. Like i had said before, i am scouring the web for info on these, and am starting to put together some of the pieces. Since the M1900 was first introduced at the world fair (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mannlicher-Schönauer) and not yet necessarily destined as a portuguese military trial model, is it possible that this was instead a non-military firearm to begin with? Once again, i appreciate the info in helping to piece the history of this gun together! You have all been greatly knowledgeable!


    Compare the appearance,workmanship,finish etc. of the early commercial M-S's made prior to the First World War to yours, it will answer your question.
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  • gearheaddad
    Just so you know, this thread will be locked after 10 replies or so. House rules!
    The "double trigger" is actually a "double set trigger". pull the back trigger to "set" the front trigger. Lighter trigger pull.
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  • Ambrose
    I have my 1908 Mannlicher Schoenauer carbine across my knees as I write this. Your rifle looks very much like mine. The stock with its cheek piece, checkering pattern, trap butt plate, and forward sling swivel (love the clothes-line sling BTW!) is identical to mine except, of course, it's shorter. Metal-wise, the serial # on mine is in the same place as yours, bolt handle, clip guide, barrel contour, double-set triggers, manufacturers markings, barrel index marks are all identical. The differences I note are the shorter stock, my front sight is different, and i do not see the "bolt latch" on yours. Also the receiver ring on my rifle is lightly cross-hatched rather than sippled. And, of course, mine is chambered for the 8x56 MS cartridge.

    My guess is that either your rifle was built as you see it or, if "sporterized" it was done with later, origional Mannlicher Schoenauer parts.
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  • MSM1900
    I guess this will get this thread locked, but i just wanted to pass on some more information with the last post..

    rufe-snow- from all that i have gathered from a few different people, this gun is indeed a factory sporter version M-S M1900, and not a trial gun converted to be sold as a sporter. It appears to be one of the first attempts at a sporter model by M-S. This would seem to contradict the information that all M1900's were the trial rifles. This is in no way meant to be a negative statement towards you or your information(as i really appreciated your input), i just wanted to throw that out there as there for others as there isn't a lot known about this model...

    most of the M1900's were indeed the military versions, or the converted british M1900's.. This one seems to be one of very few factory M1900 sporter models. With the low production number, there isn't a whole lot of sale history to help establish a guess at a value, but it makes this gun more interesting!

    I would still love to hear from anyone else that may have a simliar model to try to continue to piece this all together(so please email me!!!). However, seeing its low serial number, it would support this may be one of the first M-S sport guns ever made..
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