What high pressure signs?
I have reloaded high power rifle for 35 years and am well familiar with pressure signs but I have gotten a Bersa .380 and am starting to reload for it. All the manuals and advise say "work up loads". So I do. I am at max loads and see no sign of any pressure problems. I don't see how I could. At max loads I am still under 20Kpsi I bet. I don't think you will ever see any pressure signs with any of these low pressure pistol loads. What am I looking for? Gun runs perfectly, accuracy is great, and the recoil is much less than the factory loads. I stoped just because the manual said max. In defference to the typical .380's strength and recoil spring I imagine. I have the same situation with the .38 specials I am loading for use in a .357 mag.
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My thoughts would be that the people who publish load charts will always err on the side of caution. I note a difference in max loads for certain calibers from 30 years ago to now, just a few tenths but still, a difference. Not sure if it's political or if it's just because of manufacturing differences in the powder or the preciseness of the measuring equipment used to measure the pressures obtained.
I've had the same issue with .38 Specials in a .357, loaded hot and never see any pressure signs other than an occasional sticky extraction which may or may not be caused by the pressure.
I would have to conclude that there may be differences in case strength between different manufacturers and the charts always go to the lowest possible value, plus taking a safety factor as well.
I won't say what I do with the .38's, just let your conscience be your guide !!!
Dan R0 -
Hello I think one of the dangers in loading small pistol cases is because of the small case capacity and the small amounts of fast burning powder it does not take much of a mistake on the loaders part or the equipment used to get into BIG trouble. If you have a rifle case that say holds 50 grains of powder then a powder measure is accurate to .5 of a grain then this is only a 1% error likewise if the OAL of the loaded round is 1/4 inch shorter then suggested it will reduce the case capacity by a very small % . Now take a 380 auto pistol with say 2.5 Grains of Bulls-Eye powder and the same powder measure make a .5 grain error You now have a very large % error also if you seat the bullet 1/4 inch deeper in the case or the bullet is pushed in to the case when it hits the feed ramp you have reduced the case capacity buy a BIG % . I have loaded over 300,000 rounds of 45ACP but would not think of loading a 25ACP without really checking each step. .5 grain error could go from mild to Blow-Up 0 -
Considering that the "traditional pressure signs" don't show up until your over 70,000 psi, I would hope you NEVER see any pressure sign in your 380 (or the other guys 38spl).
As far as what to look for, is it accurate and reliable? Sounds good to me.
Another thing to look for, on blowback guns, is where it piles up the brass at. If it piles your reloads in the same place as factory ammo, than your slide speed is about correct.0 -
Thanks Perry - Good point! I quickly realized that I had to abandon my trusty RCBS powder measure because the pistol powder I am using packs down quite a bit and causes a "charge creep" upwards with each stroke of the handle causing load to load variations of several tenths of a grain. Out comes the Lee dippers. With some adjustment with spacers, a correct load is found, then with a bit of practice you can throw a charge with less than 1/10 grain variation no trouble at all. It's just as fast too. 0 -
Check out older reloading manuals (1970s). Some of the newer manuals are very conservative. 0 -
Another important point is that reload data has to take into account both old guns and REPEATED use of ammo.
As an example, its probably true that most modern .38 special revolvers could, if pushed, handle .357 magnum like pressures (how, why, and how stupid it might be to try this is a whole other story).
But that certainly won't be true of a turn-of the century .38 special Spanish revolver, and no manufacturer of powder who puts out reloading manuals wants to be held financially responsible for you grenading your old gun with a load that actually would be safe in a tougher modern one.
Its also true that while a given gun won't necessarily blow up firing overloaded ammo, the extra stress over time will cause the gun to wear out much faster. That's probably more true of a blowback type gun than other designs.
With .380s, SAAMI max pressure is actually pretty low, only 21,500 PSI, but that's because the cartridge was intended mainly for blowback action designs that aren't safe with high pressure rounds.
In a modern breech-locking design, I bet you could probably push a .380 case a LOT higher than 21500 PSI safely. But just because you "can" doesn't mean you "should". Especially with today's ready availability of small 9mm luger guns, there is less and less of a reason to want to try this.
While its not a direct measure of pressure, out of curiosity, you might chronograph the "max" .380 loads to see how fast they go. If you're using a typical fast-burning pistol powder, and your loads are chronographing near or below normal factory loads, its probably reasonable to assume that your pressures are at or below normal too.0 -
I've loaded 25ACP because I wanted some hollow point loads.
After a few, I gave up because of pinching of thumb and forefinger and the real possibility of damage to the finger tips.
You need tongs to safely load them.
I assume that would also hold true for 32 short and ACP.
It would be wise to stick to factory load equivalents for blowback action pistols and rifles.0
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