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Got asked a question I couldn't answer

wittynbear
A friend at work called me tonight and asked me about buying a AR upper with a 14 inch barrel snd a silencer. He was wondering what he needed to do and when he needed to do it.

I told him I was pretty sure he would have to pay for a $200 stamp for the silencer, and the upper. He asked if he would have to pay when he bought it or when he put it on a rifle. For the silencer I know its when you buy it, but because they make an AR pistol which would be exempt from being a SBR because its a pistol I didn't know if he needed to pay for the tax stamp when he bought the upper or just before putting it on a lower with a buttstock.

I told him to look on wikipedia and between the 2 of us we couldn't make sense of the garbage on wikipedia. We don't have any gunshops here that sell such things or I'd refer him there.

So I have to ask when does one have to pay for a tax stamp on a 14inch AR upper before placing it on a rifle lower or when they buy it even though it could easily go on an ar pistol lower which would be exempt from the tax stamp?
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Comments

9 comments

Date Votes
  • rufe-snow
    He is going to have to go through a Class 3 dealer for both the 14" barrel and the silencer. Advise him compile a list of Class 3's to contact, ( lot of them advertise and are active on various on-line forums that concern machine guns, silencers, SBR's etc.) There is no way around this he will have to obtain these items from/through a Class 3. Instead of losing any sleep over this let the Class 3 handle it, this is how they make their money.
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  • givette
    "He asked if he would have to pay when he bought it or when he put it on a rifle"

    This has eliminated a lot of guesswork. Since it will be going on a non-pistol AR type frame, there's two NFA tax stamps needed.
    One with the SerNo of the silencer, and one that has the SerNo of the lower receiver.

    Ya pays 'yer monies when ya mails in 'yer request. Each request form will need to have a SerNo on them..one for the gun, one for the silencer.

    Procedurally, you'll be registering the lower as the NFA item, by the way.

    Silencer will be held by the C3 FFL till the paperwork clears. Then you will take posession. Not so with the upper.

    You can buy any upper at any time for your NFA registered lower after that paperwork clears. You won't be needing the services of a C3 FFL. You will already have a registered NFA lower for any and all uppers you wish to order directly through catalogs, etc.

    Good luck! Joe
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  • nmyers
    The place for your friend to go, if he wants to read the law for himself, is Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide (ATF P5300.4), NOT a blog on the Internet.

    Anyone can possess a 10" or 14" barrel, or an upper with either barrel. If he wants to ASSEMBLE a rifle with either barrel, he must first submit the application with the $200 check & await ATF approval; as Joe says, the SBR that they will approve will have the SN of the lower receiver, but can have any upper.

    But, considering your friends lack of knowledge, I would recommend none of the above. I suggest that your friend locate a Class 3 dealer in his state WHO IS ALSO A CLASS 3 REPAIR FACILITY, & buy everything from him, with a written guarantee that the completed rifle will function reliably. If your friend just buys parts, he is likely to end up with a rifle that fails to cycle & is LOUD.

    Neal
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  • wittynbear
    OK thanks guys he has contacted and ordered from a class 3 dealer in Mobile (nice 3 1/2 hour drive) supposedly the only one he could find online. Who knows how hard he looked, if I was a betting man I'd say he went with the first name on the first list he found. He has everything in line now and when it all comes in it will be interesting to see.

    Apparently now he is going with a 14" silenced barrel on a fully auto lower with a shortened shotgun on the underside. He will be paying about $4500 for everything. I think the guy saw him coming from a mile away with idiot stamped on his forehead, you could buy a car with $4500. Seems like a lot of money just to have a rifle that burns through ammo so fast, especially at the current prices.

    To each his own I guess. Thanks for all the help guys I have actually learned a lot. (mostly class 3 is not worth the time or money, but thats just my opinion.)
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  • rufe-snow
    quote:Originally posted by wittynbear

    Apparently now he is going with a 14" silenced barrel on a fully auto lower with a shortened shotgun on the underside. He will be paying about $4500 for everything.




    It's hard to believe, but if if is able to get a legal, class 3, selective fire, short barreled AR, with a short barreled shotgun, for only $4500, he's getting a heck of a bargain nowadays. Since the feds outlawed the commercial manufacturer of selective fire firearms back in 86, their prices have increased exponentially. He'll never lose a dime on it, and stands to make a lot by just sitting on it for a number of years. As long as the pricks in Washington don't go changing the federal firearms laws again.
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  • cpermd
    Something is VERRY wrong with this story.

    CP
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  • givette
    Fishy..

    A stripped C3 AR receiver will, by and of itself, go for somewhere North of eight thousand dollars.

    And you're talkin' SBS, and silencer, also?

    ....don't loan your friend any money.


    Joe
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  • wittynbear
    quote:Originally posted by givette
    Fishy..

    A stripped C3 AR receiver will, by and of itself, go for somewhere North of eight thousand dollars.

    And you're talkin' SBS, and silencer, also?

    ....don't loan your friend any money.


    Joe
    Damn, I wouldn't pay more than $80 for it, either his numbers are wrong, got fed full of BS and is being taken for a ride, or lying through his teeth. Any of the first 2 are a possibility, he's no albert einstein, but he's a good guy and if he's lying its the first I've heard of it. I'll relay the info.
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  • dfletcher
    "Constructive Possession" applies to SBRs. If he owns an AR 4473'd as a long gun and does not also own either an AR pistol, a stripped AR receiver or an AR lower with attached buttstock that were 4473'd as "other" then possession of the AR rifle and an upper fewer than 16", even unassembled, is constructive possession of an SBR.

    It sounds like he's doing a fair amount of work on this, he should be certain to do things in the correct order to ensure he doesn't have a moment of exposure.
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