.223 Help
I have a Rem. 700 Varmit in .223. it already shoots sub MOA at 200 yards with Hornady 55 grain factory loads. But I would like to go to a heavier bullet and I have a 1-14 twist. Can someone tell me the fastest I can reasonably push a 75 grain bullet in .223? I have very little reloading experiance but I have some equipment.
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Just because somebody does like something doesn't make it right or smart, either.
The .223 simply doesn't have the case capacity to launch heavy bullets fast enough to take advantage of whatever benefits you think a heavy bullet has. The principle of diminishing returns rears its head here, and the .223 is best with bullets of about 60 grains and less.
You are free to try anything you like. If a 150-gr .22-caliber bullet out of the .22 Short case with a twist of one turn per inch tingles your leg, go for it. But don't try to convince anybody that it is the answer to everything. Or anything.0 -
Rocky,
As usual, you want to have it your way and no one else has theirs. It is perfectly okay to shoot a .223 to 1k. If shooting anything is smart then shooting a .223 to 1k is no different. Is it stupid to shoot a .308 to 1k when you can use a .260? I would say first it depends on the experience of the shooter. Just because the .260 is a wind cheater doesn't mean someone who gets on one will know how much wind to shoot. Therefore it may or may not be able to beat a .223 or .308. For just shooting the .223 to 1k, I can't see any reason what so ever that it's stupid. No more stupid than shooting any other cartridge to 1k.
And, since you don't feel like using your brain, use the 60 gr's to 1k. See how far that gets you. I have less success using 55/60 gr. Amax's to 1k than I do 70-80 gr. bullets that are made to fly long distance well.
Again, just because you don't like it, doesn't mean it's wrong or stupid. I think you are clearly showing your ignorance and lack of an open mind here.0 -
My mind is open. I did say you are free to do anything you like, did I not? Nor have I abused you or anyone else. I said that the practice of shooting a .223 at 1,000 yards is ludicrous.
Will bullets from that rifle go that far? Heck yes. Most centerfire rifles can shoot a bullet for several miles. That doesn't make "miles" a practical range.
As you yourself say, "It is no more stupid than shooting any other cartridge to 1k." And I agree wholeheartedly, because shooting to 1,000 yards IS stupid. (We are not talking military use here. We are talking about civilian shooting.) Target competition to 1,000 yards is done, but it is very much a minor sport. And those who do it don't use many .223s.
Finally, you do seem very insistent on having this YOUR way.0 -
quote:Originally posted by bambambam
Wasn't there something on TV recently about a US sniper with a .308 in Bagdad or similar place, downing a guy with a rifle making pock shots at our men? I think it was on the history channel and the show was about snipers and the longest shots recorded.
They also showed the sniper from Vietnam who killed 30-40 guys by a river close range. This man I think also had the most kills in Vietnam too?
quote:Originally posted by JustC
bullet weight, is mostly dependant on bullet length. Given a specific dia, the bullet length can only vary a by a small amount, in order to be the same weight. It is the lenght of the the BEARING SURFACE that makes the difference.
VLD pills have a long bearing surface, and therefore, need a faster twist.
as far as a 223 at 1000yds, it has been done. The military states the effective range of the .308 at somewhere aroung 800yds, but clean kills have been recorded far beyond that.
I recall that special, but don't remember any details about the sniper other than he was military. It was a loooong shot across to a balcony of another highrise building, especially having to calculate the wind drift for a first shot kill, which he made.[8D] IIRC it was also far beyond 1000yds.
folks get all intimidated by the number,..." ONE THOUSAND YARDS " makes them all giddy with anticipation or doubting their rifle/load etc. I showed up to the IBS 1000yd nationals having never even fired at a target much beyond 600yds. A guy set-up behind me with a set of "big eyes" and watched my bullet turbulence and subsequent impact. I made an adjustment then fired for effect, was told again where my impact was, made another adjustment, and VOILA I was on paper[^] I even shot right at MOA my very first time on paper at 1000yds. You have to shoot at the target to get any practice/experience. Run a good drop table and get after it. You may very well be suprised at how well you do, I know I left that day very happy for a first timer at 1000yds.0 -
Yep, that's the one. I was thinking it was a mile or mile and a half because they were talking about the crazy hold over he had to make the shot. I was thinking it took him 2 or 3 shots to make the hit.
quote:Originally posted by JustC
quote:Originally posted by bambambam
Wasn't there something on TV recently about a US sniper with a .308 in Bagdad or similar place, downing a guy with a rifle making pock shots at our men? I think it was on the history channel and the show was about snipers and the longest shots recorded.
They also showed the sniper from Vietnam who killed 30-40 guys by a river close range. This man I think also had the most kills in Vietnam too?
quote:Originally posted by JustC
bullet weight, is mostly dependant on bullet length. Given a specific dia, the bullet length can only vary a by a small amount, in order to be the same weight. It is the lenght of the the BEARING SURFACE that makes the difference.
VLD pills have a long bearing surface, and therefore, need a faster twist.
as far as a 223 at 1000yds, it has been done. The military states the effective range of the .308 at somewhere aroung 800yds, but clean kills have been recorded far beyond that.
I recall that special, but don't remember any details about the sniper other than he was military. It was a loooong shot across to a balcony of another highrise building, especially having to calculate the wind drift for a first shot kill, which he made.[8D] IIRC it was also far beyond 1000yds.
folks get all intimidated by the number,..." ONE THOUSAND YARDS " makes them all giddy with anticipation or doubting their rifle/load etc. I showed up to the IBS 1000yd nationals having never even fired at a target much beyond 600yds. A guy set-up behind me with a set of "big eyes" and watched my bullet turbulence and subsequent impact. I made an adjustment then fired for effect, was told again where my impact was, made another adjustment, and VOILA I was on paper[^] I even shot right at MOA my very first time on paper at 1000yds. You have to shoot at the target to get any practice/experience. Run a good drop table and get after it. You may very well be suprised at how well you do, I know I left that day very happy for a first timer at 1000yds.0 -
There were some really good shots on that show:
Ethan Place, the Marine who had 19 kills from 150-800m through a couple holes in a wall in front of his position. Including a running 650m shot.
Robert Reichert, a Marine who made a one mile shot with a .50 cal with a RAUFUSS round. He hit the wall they were behind. The round exploded in the wall as expected and the fragments splattered three bad guys.
Rob Furlong, The Canadian who took three shots to nail a taliban fighter in Afghanistan at 1.51 miles or 2430m or 2657.5 yards.
Craig Harrison, in November 2009, a British sniper engaged a taliban machine gun team @ 1.538 miles or 2707 yds. It took nine shots for him to 'come-up' to the machine gunner. The AG then started trying to work the gun and he used the same hold and shot him as well. A third consecutive shot at the machine gun itself hit and destroyed that. He was shooting an Accuracy International .338 Lapua.
James Gilliland, The longest (so far) 7.62x51 NATO kill was by James Gilliland. He was shooting to suppress the sniper that just shot his friend. He killed him on the first shot. With his scope held 8 ft. high and 8 ft left. From a long range zero.0
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