.22 training-AR style
I'm looking at S&W, COLT,and H&K416. The local gunshop declined to offer guidance. Has anyone tried the H&K416? How do they all compare? Thanks for any assistance.
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I am not really sure about the HK416, but the S&W, and Colt, I believe have a lower reciever that has been modified to handle just the 22LR upper. That being the 22LR upper, has everything it needs as far as recoil spring, bolt, etc., that it needs to function independantly of the lower.
That said, there is also another company that offer's just the 22LR upper, and the whole complete rifle, on an unmodified lower, that can accept centerfire uppers as well. That company marketing them is ATI.
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My approach with the 22 "AR type" is to put a dedicated rimfire on a centerfire lower, I use CMMG but there are many others. Of course this supposes someone already has the lower, or will buy a centerfire lower and rimfire upper separately as opposed to an assembled gun. Some folks prefer to not do that.
Of the guns you mentioned the HK has gotten best reviews. I've handled the Colt and S & W and they simply feel too "plasticky" and unlike the real thing for me and that's why I went with a separate upper.
The Sig 522 is another one I've handled and it gets excellent reviews, especially for its feeling and looking much like its centerfire version the 556. At any gun show, when I walk buy a table selling the Sig brand I always do a brief double take when I see what looks like a 556 for $425.00 .... [:p] Were I going to buy a "tactical" 22 rimfire that's the one I'd get, actually I probably will get one.0 -
There are any number of .22 "trainer" type guns on the market now:
Colt (which is actually made by Umarex/Walther), Smith, Ruger, SIG, etc.
I'd say if you want the best possible "training" experience for your AR, then get an actual AR-15 rifle, and a dedicated .22LR upper.
That way you are effectively using the exact same gun for training as you would be for fighting (or whatever you think you'd be doing with your AR-15), not some third parties rendition of said gun.
If the goal is "practice like you play" then having a gun with the EXACT same stock, grip, trigger, and safety should be the best training tool.
Cost of a dedicated .22LR upper is basically the same as one of the lookalike .22-only guns.
The disadvantage of a dedicated .22 upper is that you don't have two separate guns. But apart from the above advantage, another one is that since the upper itself isn't actually a "firearm" (the receiver part is) you can literally have it mailed to your house.0 -
If you have a 5.56 AR you can get a 22lr conversion kit and have the best of both worlds. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by dcs shooters
If you have a 5.56 AR you can get a 22lr conversion kit and have the best of both worlds.
Well, there are two drawbacks to a drop in .22 conversion (as opposed to a dedicated .22LR upper).
Use of soft lead bullets can theoretically clog up the gas port in a standard AR-15.
More important, barrel diameter and rate of twist on a typical .223 AR-15 barrel aren't optimized for .22LR, which means that if you use a drop in .22 conversion you won't get the accuracy you could with a dedicated upper.
But yeah, this is one way to go.
EDIT:
Just noticed, there is a review article on a variety of these so-called "tactical" .22LR guns in the December 2010 issue of the American Rifleman magazine.
You could look there for more information. Some public libraries carry this magazine.0 -
i had bad luck with the smith. i would buy a .22 upper instead 0 -
I have the S&W and love it. 0 -
Regarding the conversion units, in addition to the previously mentioned accuracy issues I would think the long jump from chamber through freebore to rifling doesn't help accuracy at all. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by dfletcher
Regarding the conversion units, in addition to the previously mentioned accuracy issues I would think the long jump from chamber through freebore to rifling doesn't help accuracy at all.
It has more to do with the twist rate. The 22LR's 30-40 grain bullet needs a 1 in 18 twist rate, not a 1 in 7 or 1 in 9. But the free bore does not help. The dedicated upper is the way to go.
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quote:Originally posted by 22sport
I'm looking at S&W, COLT,and H&K416. The local gunshop declined to offer guidance. Has anyone tried the H&K416? How do they all compare? Thanks for any assistance.
my personal experience with .22's is: forget the Colt, it is a total abomination with weirdness thrown in. for a .22 built from scratch the best in my OPINION is the S&W M&P 15-22. i own two of them and rate them as #1 for a dedicated .22 AR-15 style rifle. for a dedicated upper, i would recommend the Tac-Sol upper, it has an all steel barrel, 1-16 twist, my biggest complaint with this one is the type magazine, it is based on the Ciener style and SUX !! reliability is OK, it is just too damn hard to re-fill after you get 20 rounds in it, those last 10 rounds are a bitch to get in.
personally i love AR-15/22's, got 5 of them.0
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