Screwy load data?
I have the Lyman reloading handbook, 46th edition and just started reloading for my wife's new Sig 2022 9mm. Anyway I've loaded several thousand 9mm using the Lyman cast (#356402) 121gr bullet ahead of 4.3 gr of Bullseye and had no problems with it running my 9mms. The Sig doesn't like that recipe....they don't eject on a reliable basis so I figured I'd load them a bit hotter for the Sig.
What I found in the manual doesn't make sense to me. The max load listed for Bullseye using a 125gr jacketed bullet is 4.8 grains and the max load for a 121gr cast bullet is 4.4gr. Somehow this doesn't seem logical that a lighter cast bullet would have a lower maximum charge.
Any ideas would be appreciated.
What I found in the manual doesn't make sense to me. The max load listed for Bullseye using a 125gr jacketed bullet is 4.8 grains and the max load for a 121gr cast bullet is 4.4gr. Somehow this doesn't seem logical that a lighter cast bullet would have a lower maximum charge.
Any ideas would be appreciated.
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Softer lead will strip in the rifling. Lyman actually only lists loads that shoot somewhat well. 0 -
Several factors may be involved. The cast bullet may have a longer bearing surface, even though it is lighter. Cast bullets are normally larger in diameter than jacketed, some of which can be quite undersized. Besides, in a high-intensity round like the 9mm, four grains of bullet weight doesn't mean diddly; they are essentially the same weight.
Lastly, the 46th is three editions old. The current 49th shows a max of 4.5 Bullseye under the Sierra 125 JHP and 4.2 max under two different 120-gr cast bullets.The cast bullets get from 50 to 100 fps more than the JHP, despite the lower charge - and higher pressures as well.0 -
Rocky,
I probably should have mentioned that my cast bullets are sized to .356.
If I drop the charge by 1/10 grain, this thing will probably turn into a single shot and I hate the thought of actually having to buy jacketed bullets!0 -
I'd try a different powder first. I suggest 4.4 of W231 or 5.0 Unique or Universal. If you don't mind muzzle flash, 5.6 of Power Pistol. 0 -
Considering that 3 grains of bullseye cycles all my 9mms, including the Luger with the rather.... stiff toggle, I wonder if the powder charge is really the issue? 0 -
I'll try some Unique and hope it's just a case of the pistol being new. I'll also order some jacketed bullets. It functions quite well with the XTPs at less than max charges.
Thanks to all for the input and explanation ....had me scratching my bald old head.0 -
If it's truly a brand new pistol, I'd run a couple hundred rounds of inexpensive FMJ ammo through it before trying cast-bullet reloads. Smoothing the action as well as the bore could make a huge difference in cycling reliability. There's no cheaper ammo than 9mm; in fact, it's so cheap it's the only cartridge I don't reload for. 0 -
If you like the load but the pistol wont cycle, look up Wolf springs.
They sell recoil spring calibration packs to enable tailoring the gun to the load.
The objective is to find the heaviest spring that will reliably hang the slide up on the slide stop using your light loads, single shot.
Then test to see it will feed from a full magazine
That spring should not be used on +P or max loads.
Notice the many spring offerings for the 1911. Some target and competitive shooters shoot real pip squeak loads and others want to shoot 10MM and other very powerful loads requiring much heavier than standard springs to keep from beating their guns to death.0 -
Just returned from shooting and I think she's "limp wristing" it as I had no problems. Being that today was only the second time shooting a pistol, in her 52 years, I should have expected it. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by hunter86004
Just returned from shooting and I think she's "limp wristing" it as I had no problems. Being that today was only the second time shooting a pistol, in her 52 years, I should have expected it.
You should have told us this in the first place. That would have been our guess right from the get-go [;)]0 -
charliemeyer007:
You can't get a 9x19 to go fast enough to have a decent cast bullet strip in the rifling. A well-fitting cast bullet with good lube is good for at least 1500fps. I have taken some plain-base bullets up to 1700 fps. Proper diameter and alloy for the pressure lets the bullet perform exceptionally well.
Did the manual show the pressure? If not, look at the velocity. If pressure or velocity is low for the bullet weight, they may be showing light target loads, as that is what many people load cast bullets for.
I have wondered over some of the very low charge weight loads shown for cast bullets with max pressures listed. I "assume" it is their set-up and load my own with care.0 -
Forget to mention:
9x19 barrels can have a groove diameter that ranges from 0.355 to 0.362". You need to slug your barrel to get the most out of cast or swaged lead bullets. Bullets almost always have to be at least 0.001" over groove diameter.
I find that 0.357" cast lead bullets are more accurate than 0.365" cast lead bullets (likewise, 0.356" jacketed bullets are often more consistently accurate than 0.355" jacketed bullets).
If you gun functions great with factory ammo and is just barely cycling with your reloads, then that charge weight is NOT near max.
New guns often need at least 200 rounds to "wear in" and start performing at their best.0
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