Colt Detective Special question
i came across a 38 special ctg 2" barrel Colt Detective Special this past week but there are a few things "odd" about the revolver based on what I have read about these handguns. It came in a well worn what appears to be an original box that has its serial number written on the bottom of the box. It matches the number on the frame located where the crane closes. I do not see a letter prefix at either place. The serial number starts with "9" in both places The original box has a sticker on it indicating it was sold at JC Penny Co. for $79.50. It has the wood wrap around stock with the silver Colt emblems, fixed blade type sight and no shroud over the ejector rod. Also the rampant colt stamp near the cylinder release is very faint but easily seen. Does anyone one know if JC Penny sold the same grade of Colt as other retailers? Is there another place to look for a serial number that might have a letter starting the serial number? I have not removed the single piece stock at this point since I removed the machine screw but the grips remained tight in place.
According to the seller the gun was purchassed by his wife's first husband and fired one time. I also received a box of nickle cased cartriges that is missing one cartridge. There is one small spot of surface rust near the front blade sight and a couple of spots near the rampant colt on the frame. Other than that the bluing is near perfect. I hope I got a decent deal on it at $300.00.
Edit: Thanks for all the information, I really appreciate it. The picture posted is exactly like the one I got. Not knowing anything at all about ths model of Colt revolver but knowing a little about S&W revolvers I thought it odd that the hammer showed no signs of case coloring. Also the light strike of the rampant Colt made me think the revolver may have been polished, but I think it is original as my co-worker told me. The cartridges are the lead bullets in nickel cases unfortunately the box is coming apart and in bad shape. It looks like it had oil leak all over it. I think the little rascal is growing on me.
According to the seller the gun was purchassed by his wife's first husband and fired one time. I also received a box of nickle cased cartriges that is missing one cartridge. There is one small spot of surface rust near the front blade sight and a couple of spots near the rampant colt on the frame. Other than that the bluing is near perfect. I hope I got a decent deal on it at $300.00.
Edit: Thanks for all the information, I really appreciate it. The picture posted is exactly like the one I got. Not knowing anything at all about ths model of Colt revolver but knowing a little about S&W revolvers I thought it odd that the hammer showed no signs of case coloring. Also the light strike of the rampant Colt made me think the revolver may have been polished, but I think it is original as my co-worker told me. The cartridges are the lead bullets in nickel cases unfortunately the box is coming apart and in bad shape. It looks like it had oil leak all over it. I think the little rascal is growing on me.
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Tell me, experts, which variant is this Colt?
http://www.gunbroker.com/auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=32209552
A potential bidder had a question about it. I think it is a third variation, and not +P rated. What do you think?
FFL Dealer/Full time Peace Officer, Moderator of General Discussion Board on Gunbroker. Visit www.gunbroker.com the best gun auction site on the Net! Email gpd035@sbcglobal.net0 -
Photos are always helpful when you want information about any gun.
But, it sounds like you have a 1st generation DS, which has the exposed ejector rod. Based on the price tag, I'm guessing that it was made in the 50's. I don't recall having any Penney stores in my area at that time, but it wouldn't surprise me if they sold guns, as Sears & Montgomery Ward certainly did.
Colt has never made different quality guns of any model. Any "cheapening" of a gun, such as Parkerizing instead of polish/bluing, would be a cataloged variation.
Your grips are probably being held on by dried oil. Try gently tapping on them with a piece of soft wood.
The "official" place for the SN is the bottom of the grip, but it's covered by the grips; it's also shown on the side of the frame, as you found. It shouldn't have a prefix, although the Cobra will have an LW suffix (for lightweight).
If you search the forum archives for "rust", you will find a number of suggestions for (possibly) removing yours. My choice would be to soak with Kroil & rub with burlap, or, failing that, bronze wool.
We really can't guess the market value without photos, but, at $300, you couldn't possibly go wrong.
Neal
EDIT: Ummm, yes, a senior moment. I was, of course, thinking of S&W's for the SN location.0 -
Need a partial serial number, for DOM. Don't understand what your considering odd about the Detective Special. Appears from your description to be standard unshrouded extractor model, that Colt made for 30+ years. Need quality photos for identification and valuation, as Neal pointed out.
Photo below is of a Detective Special, I got off the net. Compare it to yours.
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Most Fire arm dealers get the Same GRADE of firearms . No seconds ETC However some Distributors get the maker to sell them SPECIAL runs of slightly modified models. I would say JC PENNYwould stoch and sell STANDARD model guns 95% OF THE TIME 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Robin
I hope I got a decent deal on it at $300.00.
For an old Colt Detective Special with original box in >90% condition?
You "stole" it.0 -
I'll give you $450 sight unseen! You did great at that price. These were very well made and durable revolvers - I wouldn't want to give it a steady diet of +p, but it could take a few for self-defense. Take a look at the box of ammo you got with it, they are probably 158 grain round nose lead bullets, but they may be the old 200 grain "Super Police" load. If so they may have value themselves to a collector, especially with the box. Good Buy! 0 -
quote:Originally posted by beantownshootah
quote:Originally posted by Robin
I hope I got a decent deal on it at $300.00.
For an old Colt Detective Special with original box in >90% condition?
You "stole" it.
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quote:Originally posted by nmyers
But, it sounds like you have a 1st generation DS, which has the exposed ejector rod. Based on the price tag, I'm guessing that it was made in the 50's. I don't recall having any Penney stores in my area at that time, but it wouldn't surprise me if they sold guns, as Sears & Montgomery Ward certainly did.
The "official" place for the SN is the bottom of the grip, but it's covered by the grips; it's also shown on the side of the frame, as you found.
If you search the forum archives for "rust", you will find a number of suggestions for (possibly) removing yours. My choice would be to soak with Kroil & rub with burlap, or, failing that, bronze wool.
The Detective Special was introduced in 1927 as a variation of the Police Positive Special. These early guns had a square butt. For the sake of illustration only, I would call these guns "First Generation." In 1933, the butt was changed to what Colt calls "round butt," which would be "Second Generation." After World War II, the front sight was changed from round to ramped, which I would call "Third Generation." These early Post-War guns had plastic stocks, which were changed to wood in the mid-1950s. I do not consider the stock material as another "Generation," but some might. In 1966, the butt frame was shortened, which is "Fourth Generation." In 1972, the shrouded barrel was introduced, which I count as "Fifth Generation." In 1984, Colt introduced a "discount" version of the Detective Special with matte finish called the Commando. Some might consider that another "generation" of the Detective Special. I do not because the Detective Special remained in production during that time. The Detective Special and Commando were discontinued for 1987. Colt redesigned the lockwork in 1995 and introduced the SF-VI, which could be called the "Sixth Generation." It was replaced by the DS-II in 1997, which could be called the "Seventh Generation." The DS-II was discontinued after 1998. The Magnum Carry was introduced in 1999 and could be called the "Eighth Generation." The Magnum Carry was discontinued in 1999, along with all other Colt double-action revolvers except the Python, which has now been discontinued as well. Obviously, the mere lack of a shroud around the ejector rod does not make a Detective Special a "First Generation."
It seems to me the best way to identify a Colt Detective Special is either by year or period of manufacture and/or by features (such as Pre-War Square Butt, Post-1965 -- Pre-1972, abbreviated butt and unshrouded ejector rod, etc.). As I have tried to illustrate, there are a lot more "generations" or "issues" than the "Blue Book" recognizes.
Yes, J. C. Penny sold guns. I purchased my old Remington Model 1100 at Penny's in 1968.
A Detective Special never had a serial number on the butt in any of its several variations. Off hand, I can't think of any Colt that has a serial number on its butt. (Neal may have Smith & Wesson on his mind!)
I recommend Big Frontier Metal Cleaner for removing rust. It looks like a "Choir Girl" dish pad, but is not and will not scratch the blue when removing rust. (Google it for more information.)
Any Detective Special that is decent is worth a lot more than $300! Buy a lottery ticket tomorrow!0 -
quote:Originally posted by JudgeColt
A Detective Special never had a serial number on the butt in any of its several variations. Off hand, I can't think of any Colt that has a serial number on its butt. (Neal may have Smith & Wesson on his mind!)0 -
quote:Originally posted by Robin
I have not removed the single piece stock at this point since I removed the machine screw but the grips remained tight in place.Back the grip screw out to where it's only being held in the right panel by a couple of turns.
Tap the screw head with a suitable size, non-marring object and this will push the right panel away from the frame.
Now insert your non-marring tool through the frame and tap the left panel from the inside.0 -
rufe-snow, the number on the butt of the Model 1917 (and on the Model 1909) is the service number, NOT the serial number.
Confession: I just remembered that the "left wheelers" (New Army/New Navy, M1892, etc.) DO have their serial number on the butt. But anything later does not.0
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