FB Radom Pictures
These are the pictures from the previous topic that is now locked.
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Thanks, go back to imageshack and look for the "fullsize" listing. 0 -
These are the full size images.
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Nice pistol with history! I would like to have one of these for my "Axis and Allies" collection. 0 -
cornbean....thanks for the photos....they really help. Your Radom is not rare (over 70k made of just that series) nor is your bnz holster...as a matter of fact, I have seen quite a few of both in much nicer shape. BUT....and it is a BIG butt..what is rather rare is to have the capture papers that correctly id the weapon. Now to further the collection and make the circle round, get your father to tell his story as to how he came on the Radom and have the paper notarized. Full circle and now you have something that is important to a collector down the road...and perhaps to your family. Congrats for asking us and thanks to your father for his service to our country. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by gary wray
cornbean....thanks for the photos....they really help. Your Radom is not rare (over 70k made of just that series) nor is your bnz holster...as a matter of fact, I have seen quite a few of both in much nicer shape. BUT....and it is a BIG butt..what is rather rare is to have the capture papers that correctly id the weapon. Now to further the collection and make the circle round, get your father to tell his story as to how he came on the Radom and have the paper notarized. Full circle and now you have something that is important to a collector down the road...and perhaps to your family. Congrats for asking us and thanks to your father for his service to our country.
Often, things like these pistols change hands after someone dies; I don't think anything was said about whether or not "cornbean's" father was still alive. If he is, it wouldn't hurt to do as suggested, but there may not be a particularly engaging "war story" about how the man originally came into possession of it. Many firearms with capture papers started with very unremarkable stories.
If you are thinking of selling, I'd recommend that you break up the items to get the most for them. Sell the one extra magazine (mentioned in your other thread) individually; sell the holster individually (I think you'll do quite well on that if you reach the right market -- dated as it is, I'd say it is less common and more valuable than gary seems to imply in his comments). Do sell the capture papers and the pistol (with one magazine) as one set since the papers are specific to that pistol.
Obviously, if you're going to keep it, then keep everything together. Since I'm not sure what your experience is with firearms, if you are keeping it, do not be storing the pistol in the holster itself as it may hold moisture and cause rust.
Thanks for sharing the photos. A lot of neat history there!0 -
quote:Originally posted by us55840
I know a person that has a near pristine Radom with eagle stamps and super nice holster.
Any idea what they are worth today ..guess a mate is Ok as no pics. They live several states away.
Just curious.
I may be able to get more info if specifics needed.
I've seen very nice Polish eagle Radoms with original holsters bring a few thousand dollars. Detailed pictures (as collectors like to see before they pay significant money for stuff like that) would be needed to be sure everything is "correct" and to determine where the pistol falls in its production history. For example, does it have the Polish eagle on its slide but is still Nazi-marked, or is it a pre-occupation pistol?0 -
quote:Originally posted by us55840
I know a person that has a near pristine Radom with eagle stamps and super nice holster.
Any idea what they are worth today ..guess a mate is Ok as no pics. They live several states away.
Just curious.
I may be able to get more info if specifics needed.
us55840.......I am assuming you are talking about an original Polish Radom with Polish Eagle. As you must know, condition is everything but with original Polish Radom's date of production is also important. As the pistol was not accepted into Polish military service until 1936, those are the rarest....about 5k or so with that date. Interestingly, the rarest on the other end of production (1945) are the 1k or so with the bnz slide code made in Austria after production was moved to the east to avoid the US forces in the west. So, date is important. From time to time you will see a Polish Radom coming up on the auction side and they bring good prices....you can dial them up and check. I can tell you that I have turned down an offer a couple of years back for my 1938 Polish Eagle of $2200...and mine has a small scratch on the reverse slide. A couple of years back I saw a 1937 Eagle in an original double mag holster with two mags in the holster and one in the VIS for $6k. Who knows what the set would go for today. As you probably know, Polish production of the VIS was limited....how many they made up to debate...I have seen figures as low as 18k and as high as 30k. All the Eagles I have seen in my life have had five digit serial #. The Germans produced up to 350k when they started production in 1940. Hope this helps.0 -
quote:Originally posted by us55840
quote:Originally posted by competentone
quote:Originally posted by us55840
I know a person that has a near pristine Radom with eagle stamps and super nice holster.
Any idea what they are worth today ..guess a mate is Ok as no pics. They live several states away.
Just curious.
I may be able to get more info if specifics needed.
I've seen very nice Polish eagle Radoms with original holsters bring a few thousand dollars. Detailed pictures (as collectors like to see before they pay significant money for stuff like that) would be needed to be sure everything is "correct" and to determine where the pistol falls in its production history. For example, does it have the Polish eagle on its slide but is still Nazi-marked, or is it a pre-occupation pistol?
Thanks for the response. The person with the Radom has a letter dated 22 Oct 1946 from a collector that states:
"
The pistol arrived safely on the 19th, and your letter explaining everything came yesterday.
Well, XXXXX you certainly are fortunate in having this gun. It's the best Radom that I've ever seen, and I have seen many of them. There is no doubt that it is brand new, and has probably never been fired. I have had some experience with these Radom pistols and in the opinion of many people, it is actually better than the Colt 45 Cal. Automatic.
Mostly because it contains an extra spring that helps to cushion the shock of that heavy slide, ramming back as it ejects the empty shell.
As to it's design, it is by our old pal, John Browning, who was truly a genius, and is responsible for just about every high class weapon ever made, including the Colt Automatics. The automatic shots guns, famous Browning automatic rifle, which was used by our Army in the two World Wars. So I hope that I've convinced you that the designer of your Gun was something more than an alley mechanic.
If you remember, the markings on your pistol are as follows.
F.B.Radom, Vis Mod 35 Pat No. 15567 and several little German Thunder Birds also stamped into the steel. All of which means the following. F.B. Radom, is the name of the Arsenal, which is located on the Vistula River in Poland. These guns were made there for the German Army, after they took Poland in 1939. Prior to that time they had made weapons for the Polish Army of course. Using good ole Brownings Patents. The Arsenal operated all during the ensuing War years., and gradually were forced to lessen the quality of their product because of the shortage of high grade steel. I've seen some of the late models which were made and they look a hell of a lot different than your gun. So yours is obviously an early model, made around 40 or 41 when the Germans were on top of the world. Lucky you.
The caliber, is of course 9mm which is the same as the Luger and the Walther P-38. The fact just about every Foreign Pistol is of that Calibre, That is the military weapons, and includes several of the British model Colts and so forth. This Ammunition was easily obtained in this Country before the War, and will again be available shortly. In fact it was a popular Cartridge here because so many men owned Luger and Mauser Pistols. I bought some once from V.L.&A at $2.00 per box.
You probably noticed a great similarity between this pistol, and the Colt Army 45, Why Not? they were both Designed by Old Man Browning so don't feel that this is a cheap imitation of a Colt."
The letter continues with some personal comments. No value is given and would be invalid anyway since it was written in 1946.
The person with the pistol received it from the person to whom the 1946 letter was addressed. It has been and is greased with no scratches.
There is also an original holster in great condition, a few scratches and some wear marks. The holster is marked P35 with eagles (Thunderbirds) on inside flap and a dozen bullets. It has not been fired since received. Also doubtful the previous owner fired it.
Hope this information helps.....and thank you.
us55840...well, like the Radom cornbean has mentioned, this one is also a German occupied Radom as the "collector" talked about "Thunderbirds" meaning German Waffenmarks. So, it is not evidently one of the rarer Polish Eagles but it sounds as if it is a good pistol with all of his comments as to condition. So, pictures would be important. I would be more interested in the hoster he describes as it talks about "bullets" in it and all the holsters I have seen for the Radom have a pocket for the mag but I have never seen one for loose "bullets" so that might be interesting. Since there were so many German occupied made Radoms the holsters for them were varied and in a variety of conditions but it sounds like this holster might be a rare bird and worth some bucks. Again, German occupied Radoms are not rare but if this one perhaps is one of the last made in Austria by bnz in a bnz holster...well, check my other comments. As to the "collectors" comments on the Radom, he is absolutly correct that it is one fine gun, but the two Polish designers would argue I am sure that they designed it all by themselves without any "help" from the great John Browning, but it bears a great resemblence to the Browning designed P35 made by FN, so much so that is why the Germans called it what they did! And, as a Colt collector, I would take a small issue with the comments about the great 1911...I love my Polish Eagle but it ain't no 1911![:D] Hope this helps.0 -
quote:Originally posted by us55840
quote:Originally posted by competentone
quote:Originally posted by us55840
I know a person that has a near pristine Radom with eagle stamps and super nice holster.
Any idea what they are worth today ..guess a mate is Ok as no pics. They live several states away.
Just curious.
I may be able to get more info if specifics needed.
I've seen very nice Polish eagle Radoms with original holsters bring a few thousand dollars. Detailed pictures (as collectors like to see before they pay significant money for stuff like that) would be needed to be sure everything is "correct" and to determine where the pistol falls in its production history. For example, does it have the Polish eagle on its slide but is still Nazi-marked, or is it a pre-occupation pistol?
Thanks for the response. The person with the Radom has a letter dated 22 Oct 1946 from a collector that states:
"
The pistol arrived safely on the 19th, and your letter explaining everything came yesterday.
Well, XXXXX you certainly are fortunate in having this gun. It's the best Radom that I've ever seen, and I have seen many of them. There is no doubt that it is brand new, and has probably never been fired. I have had some experience with these Radom pistols and in the opinion of many people, it is actually better than the Colt 45 Cal. Automatic.
Mostly because it contains an extra spring that helps to cushion the shock of that heavy slide, ramming back as it ejects the empty shell.
As to it's design, it is by our old pal, John Browning, who was truly a genius, and is responsible for just about every high class weapon ever made, including the Colt Automatics. The automatic shots guns, famous Browning automatic rifle, which was used by our Army in the two World Wars. So I hope that I've convinced you that the designer of your Gun was something more than an alley mechanic.
If you remember, the markings on your pistol are as follows.
F.B.Radom, Vis Mod 35 Pat No. 15567 and several little German Thunder Birds also stamped into the steel. All of which means the following. F.B. Radom, is the name of the Arsenal, which is located on the Vistula River in Poland. These guns were made there for the German Army, after they took Poland in 1939. Prior to that time they had made weapons for the Polish Army of course. Using good ole Brownings Patents. The Arsenal operated all during the ensuing War years., and gradually were forced to lessen the quality of their product because of the shortage of high grade steel. I've seen some of the late models which were made and they look a hell of a lot different than your gun. So yours is obviously an early model, made around 40 or 41 when the Germans were on top of the world. Lucky you.
The caliber, is of course 9mm which is the same as the Luger and the Walther P-38. The fact just about every Foreign Pistol is of that Calibre, That is the military weapons, and includes several of the British model Colts and so forth. This Ammunition was easily obtained in this Country before the War, and will again be available shortly. In fact it was a popular Cartridge here because so many men owned Luger and Mauser Pistols. I bought some once from V.L.&A at $2.00 per box.
You probably noticed a great similarity between this pistol, and the Colt Army 45, Why Not? they were both Designed by Old Man Browning so don't feel that this is a cheap imitation of a Colt."
The letter continues with some personal comments. No value is given and would be invalid anyway since it was written in 1946.
The person with the pistol received it from the person to whom the 1946 letter was addressed. It has been and is greased with no scratches.
There is also an original holster in great condition, a few scratches and some wear marks. The holster is marked P35 with eagles (Thunderbirds) on inside flap and a dozen bullets. It has not been fired since received. Also doubtful the previous owner fired it.
Hope this information helps.....and thank you.
That sounds very interesting. I'd be curious to hear who the collector was -- in 1946 for a collector to have seen "many" Radoms does seem somewhat odd, but perhaps a lot of GI's who brought them back sought him out for information.
Some of what he says is somewhat inaccurate -- like the part about him saying the Radom being "designed by" Browning, or produced under Browning patents, but such mistakes would not be unlikely in 1946.
I don't see anything to indicate this is a Polish "Eagle" Radom -- in fact, the comments would seem to indicate it was a German-occupied produced gun.
It's condition, if pristine, could give it a premium -- along with this letter, depending on who this collector is, holster and even the old ammunition (particularly if German war production) -- but I'm thinking it won't be a "thousands of dollar" gun if it's not a pistol with the Polish Eagle stamped on its slide.
If you get a chance at some point to get some pictures, it would be interesting to see. There is growing collector interest in Radoms (a number of factors affecting that -- a very nice reference source on them being published last year probably helping interest); it's interesting to see what this one actually is.0
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