RIFLE and PISTOL interchange
Both T/C and RUGER make Receiver that will fit either a Rifle or Pistol,
I want to Build and list one. and I want to make sure that I write it
up to stay with-in the Law.
I have ask three (3) difference ATF agents, and got three difference answers.
Some points they all agreed on, others I think that thet just told it ther way that they wanted.
They all said that it stayed as the Factory restiered it.
you could change a rifle to a pistol,but you could not change a pistol to a rifle.once a pistol then always a pistol.
I just got two New 10/22 RUGER Receiver Frames from RUGER.Both are listed only as 10/22 Receivers.
I know that a Rifle barrel MUST be 16" long and NO LIMIT on a Pistol.
My quistion; can I build a 10/22 with a 16" light weigh barrel then
have two stocks (one Rifle & one Pistol)
Keep in mind that the Receiver is not Registered as a rifle or Pistol?
I want to Build and list one. and I want to make sure that I write it
up to stay with-in the Law.
I have ask three (3) difference ATF agents, and got three difference answers.
Some points they all agreed on, others I think that thet just told it ther way that they wanted.
They all said that it stayed as the Factory restiered it.
you could change a rifle to a pistol,but you could not change a pistol to a rifle.once a pistol then always a pistol.
I just got two New 10/22 RUGER Receiver Frames from RUGER.Both are listed only as 10/22 Receivers.
I know that a Rifle barrel MUST be 16" long and NO LIMIT on a Pistol.
My quistion; can I build a 10/22 with a 16" light weigh barrel then
have two stocks (one Rifle & one Pistol)
Keep in mind that the Receiver is not Registered as a rifle or Pistol?
0
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quote:Originally posted by Joes Custom Guns
They all said that it stayed as the Factory restiered it.
you could change a rifle to a pistol,but you could not change a pistol to a rifle.once a pistol then always a pistol.
I just got two New 10/22 RUGER Receiver Frames from RUGER.Both are listed only as 10/22 Receivers.
I know that a Rifle barrel MUST be 16" long and NO LIMIT on a Pistol.
My quistion; can I build a 10/22 with a 16" light weigh barrel then
have two stocks (one Rifle & one Pistol)
Keep in mind that the Receiver is not Registered as a rifle or Pistol?
That is in fact reversed: You can turn a pistol into a rifle but you cannot turn a rifle into a pistol. Such a modification would create a short barreled rifle or a weapon made from a rifle; either of which are National Firearms Act weapons and require registration. If the receiver is registered by the manufacturer as a rifle then it remains a rifle. You can take a pistol (say a 1911 Government) add a 16-1/2" barrel and shoulder stock and create a rifle but you cannot take an AR-15 rifle, remove the butt stock and add a 10" barrel to create a pistol. There is conflicting opinions within the ATF as to the legality of creating a pistol from a bare receiver which was not registered as such when manufactured. Most of this was during the so called Crime Bill period where stripped AR receivers were being used to produce semi automatic pistols based on the AR design. So far as I know there has never been an issue with making a stripped receiver into a rifle.0 -
Mark;
I agree with everthing that you said.But you did not give me all the information that I need.
My Receiver is not Resteristed by the Factory as either.
as long as I keep the barrel over 16" can I change the Stock back and forth.from pistol to Rifle?
quote:Originally posted by mark christian
quote:Originally posted by Joes Custom Guns
They all said that it stayed as the Factory restiered it.
you could change a rifle to a pistol,but you could not change a pistol to a rifle.once a pistol then always a pistol.
I just got two New 10/22 RUGER Receiver Frames from RUGER.Both are listed only as 10/22 Receivers.
I know that a Rifle barrel MUST be 16" long and NO LIMIT on a Pistol.
My quistion; can I build a 10/22 with a 16" light weigh barrel then
have two stocks (one Rifle & one Pistol)
Keep in mind that the Receiver is not Registered as a rifle or Pistol?
That is in fact reversed: You can turn a pistol into a rifle but you cannot turn a rifle into a pistol. Such a modification would create a short barreled rifle or a weapon made from a rifle; either of which are National Firearms Act weapons and require registration. If the receiver is registered by the manufacturer as a rifle then it remains a rifle. You can take a pistol (say a 1911 Government) add a 16-1/2" barrel and shoulder stock and create a rifle but you cannot take an AR-15 rifle, remove the butt stock and add a 10" barrel to create a pistol. There is conflicting opinions within the ATF as to the legality of creating a pistol from a bare receiver which was not registered as such when manufactured. Most of this was during the so called Crime Bill period where stripped AR receivers were being used to produce semi automatic pistols based on the AR design. So far as I know there has never been an issue with making a stripped receiver into a rifle.0 -
I would go to the horses mouth so to speak. Send the feds a letter with the specifics of what you want to do. Get their response in writing. I got the following info off the net.
The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives cannot respond to e-mail inquiries relating to technical, policy and/or legal questions. Inquiries of this nature can only be addressed through a letter outlining your questions to the following address:
Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives
Office of Public and Governmental Affairs
99 New York Avenue, NE, Room 5S 144
Washington, DC 20226 USA
You will receive a written response to your inquiry.0 -
here is what they are going to tell you... YOU NEED A MFG.LIC.period. 0 -
Will that MFG.LIC.Talk to Me and tell Me the Law.
I had a MFG. LIC. for 30+ years and the only thing that it ever done
was to held my door open for any LIO to come in,check my books, and delay my work, while they gave me their line of bull.
quote:Originally posted by 260
here is what they are going to tell you... YOU NEED A MFG.LIC.period.0 -
Only in special cases, like that of the T/C Contender Carbine kit, has the BATFE approved the switching back and forth between a rifle, and handgun configuration. That decision was with much procrastination, and diress. I believe tht there is a letter that says, that one can do this with any Contender/Encore now as it was designed to do this. You would have to look up that letter to make sure though. BTW, when doing so, make sure there is barrel at least 16 inches on it, BEFORE you add the shoulder stock.
As far as anything else, like the 10-22???? The rifle Ruger sells is a 10-22. Their pistol based on that design is a CHARGER, not a 10-22. The other manufacturers who made handguns on that type of reciever, like Magnum Research, made their own recievers, so they could register tham as for what they were building with them.
Hope this gives clarification.
Best0 -
You are right on the first RUGER CHARGER then RUGER droped both the
CHARGER and the CARBIN from their Recevers,
Now they say RUGER 10/22 .22 Long Rifle caliber on all of them.
quote:Originally posted by tsr1965
Only in special cases, like that of the T/C Contender Carbine kit, has the BATFE approved the switching back and forth between a rifle, and handgun configuration. That decision was with much procrastination, and diress. I believe tht there is a letter that says, that one can do this with any Contender/Encore now as it was designed to do this. You would have to look up that letter to make sure though. BTW, when doing so, make sure there is barrel at least 16 inches on it, BEFORE you add the shoulder stock.
As far as anything else, like the 10-22???? The rifle Ruger sells is a 10-22. Their pistol based on that design is a CHARGER, not a 10-22. The other manufacturers who made handguns on that type of reciever, like Magnum Research, made their own recievers, so they could register tham as for what they were building with them.
Hope this gives clarification.
Best0 -
quote:Originally posted by Joes Custom Guns
You are right on the first RUGER CHARGER then RUGER droped both the
CHARGER and the CARBIN from their Recevers,
Now they say RUGER 10/22 .22 Long Rifle caliber on all of them.
quote:Originally posted by tsr1965
Only in special cases, like that of the T/C Contender Carbine kit, has the BATFE approved the switching back and forth between a rifle, and handgun configuration. That decision was with much procrastination, and diress. I believe tht there is a letter that says, that one can do this with any Contender/Encore now as it was designed to do this. You would have to look up that letter to make sure though. BTW, when doing so, make sure there is barrel at least 16 inches on it, BEFORE you add the shoulder stock.
As far as anything else, like the 10-22???? The rifle Ruger sells is a 10-22. Their pistol based on that design is a CHARGER, not a 10-22. The other manufacturers who made handguns on that type of reciever, like Magnum Research, made their own recievers, so they could register tham as for what they were building with them.
Hope this gives clarification.
Best
That is incorrect, and you need to do better research.
Take a look on the auction side...there are at least a dozen CHARGER handguns on there, and all of them "22 CHARGER" on the left side of the reciever. So they did not drop the nomenclature of CHARGER. It is even on their website. This IS how they differentiate the built to register as a hand gun recievers, versus rifle, which would just be the 10-22. If you have 10-22 recievers, you have erroneously purchased recievers which were slated for a rifle.
Best0 -
On Nov. 30th. I called in an order for two 10/22 Receivers that I could use on either and the sales clerk told me that is the only way that they sold them.
I got them today and that is the way that thet are marked!0 -
Gents,
The BATFE issued a rulling, or opinion, that you can convert a pistol to a rifle, and then, back to a rifle. This is not an NFA item. The ruling/ opinion was several months ago. The caveat is that you have no short barrel, with a shoulder stock on the receiver, during the conversion, either way. However, you still cannot convert an original rifle into a pistol. This would be an NFA item. Here is that ruling:
http://www.atf.gov/regulations-rulings/rulings/atf-rulings/atf-ruling-2011-4.pdf
quote:Therefore, so long as a parts kit or collection of parts is not used to make a firearm regulated under the NFA (e.g., a short-barreled rifle or "any other weapon" as defined by 26 U.S.C. 5845(e)), no NFA firearm is made when the same parts are assembled or re-assembled in a configuration not regulated under the NFA (e.g., a pistol, or a rifle with a barrel of 16 inches or more in length). Merely assembling and disassembling such a rifle does not result in the making of a new weapon; rather, it is the same rifle in a knockdown condition (i.e., complete as to all component parts). Likewise, because it is the same weapon when reconfigured as a pistol, no "weapon made from a rifle" subject to the NFA has been made.0 -
quote:Originally posted by 260
here is what they are going to tell you... YOU NEED A MFG.LIC.period.
I believe the manufacturer's license is necessary and germane only to that party who makes the receiver.0 -
TSR is correct. Ruger clearly marks their pistol receiver as "CHARGER" and their rifle receiver as "MODEL 10/22".
Even on their website they clearly class them under different headings. Rimfire Pistols has the CHARGER. Autoloading Rifles has the 10/22.
Their catalog numbers are reversed as well for the two:
Rifle is 10/22-XXX 0r K10/22XXX for different versions of rifles
Pistol is CHR22-XXX0
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