.357 Mag. for bear?
OK, OK, I know not from a pistol. But what about a rifle or carbine? Does the increase in velocity and energy from a closed chamber barrel make up the difference?
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I wouldn't use anything less than a 44mag. with a good 300gr bullet. 0 -
Well. . .maybe. Depends on which bear, and what circumstances.
.357 is a relative "inefficient" cartridge that actually does gain a tremendous amount of energy from a long barrel.
From a 4" revolver, you'll get 1450 fps muzzle velocity with a 125 grain bullet. But from a 20" carbine, you can get 2000 fps out of the same round, for literally double the kinetic energy. Muzzle energy out of the carbine is over 1000 ft-lbs, which is no slouch.
Buffalo Bore claims 2150fps from their 158 grain "heavy" load from a 18.5" Marlin levergun, which is quite a bit more.
Edit: Compare to 2400 fps from a 150 grain 30/30 round
That means that a .357 magnum from a levergun can potentially hit over 2/3 as hard as a 30/30 (or a 7.62x39 Russian, if you prefer), though with a fatter bullet (which helps).
I think that's certainly enough to hunt a BLACK bear, if you keep the distance reasonable, and know what you're doing.
Enough to hunt a BROWN (ie Grizzly) bear? Well, people have killed them with less, but its not really a smart thing to try, if you have the ability to have something bigger.
If you're talking about defense against a bear, again, better than nothing if that's all you have, but most certainly not optimal. Super magnum revolver is typically preferred because its more handy. If you're willing to carry a longarm, a relatively cheap 12 gauge shotgun with slugs is probably a better choice.
Edit: As above, if you use the hottest loaded .357 magnum round from a rifle, and factor in the greater bullet diameter of the .357 (which can't hurt), you'll see that ballistically you can take .357 from a rifle right up to 30/30 power. If you want to use hardcast 180 grain bullets in your .357, you can, so you're not giving up bullet mass/penetration compared to say, a 170 grain 30/30, either.
Now, I think there is room to argue about whether or not a "mere" 30/30 is appropriate for the very BIGGEST black bears (which can weigh 1000 lbs), and if you have reason to suspect you're going to encounter a record-sized bear, maybe you should bring something bigger.
But that said, empirically people HAVE killed bears bigger than that with a 30/30, and more important, the .30/30 has been THE standard American Black bear cartridge for well over 100 years.
Not only has the 30/30 killed more Black bears than any other cartridge, over the years its probably killed as many as all of the other ones put together. So in my opinion, if you can do it with a 30/30 lever, a ballistically similar .357 levergun should be fine too.0 -
Like Beantown says...depends on which bear...black, yes, grizzly, brown, or polar, no. For black bear, a good stout 180-200 grain hardcast from a revolver or carbine, would be a hard pill for that critter to swallow.
However, any lesser bullet, or even that bullet at reduced velocities, make sure you save one for oneself. I do prefer at least a 44 magnum, but have carried 10mm, 357, 45 ACP, and 41 Magnin, in Blackbear country.
In BIG bear country, at least a 44 magnum, and preferrably larger(the heaviest caliber you can shoot well), would be my suggestion.
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EDIT 1
The 357 will work in a handgun, and definately work in a rifle/carbine, with the heavier counstructed bullets. Such a carbine as the newer Marlin's, and 1892 Winchester Trapper's, would be a great tool to have. Even better in 44 Magnum!
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Uhh....NO!
Not even the Black Bear. Better stick to something in the
power range of the 44 Mag. The 357 MIGHT get the job done, but
it would sure be a roll of the dice...no thanks, not with my hide!0 -
Once an S&W shooter took a Polar bear with a .357 (pre-M27) for publicity purposes. They featured it in their advertising when the .357 was the most powerful commercial handgun. In a carbine I would use one of the heavy "boutique" loads with a bullet of at least 180 grains and a large meplat for Black bear. I would not go out looking for a Grizzly, Brown, Kodiak, or Polar bear with any handgun - I certainly carry my M-29 for defense, but like my .338 WinMag a lot better for the primary purpose of taking any large tough animal. 0 -
It has and can be done with a pistol. Bears are too dumb to know they are dead. Shot placement with the proper bullet(s) is key one, having distance between you and it is good. I saw a black bear run almost 70 yards in about 2 seconds with no heart or lungs.
I vote for more gun if you can, but if a 357 was all I had, I'd make that bear eat every round I could.
As a side note that bear skull turned 3 full tilt handloads from a 44 mag at about 20 feet before the 4th made it to the brains.0 -
The primary consideration is bullet construction- most handgun bullets will not accomplish what you are asking of it. Secondly, the points to consider are the state of mind of the bear and what options are available to you if the cartridge turns out to be inadequate. 0 -
Of course, you could always get a 30-30 carbine in an approximately same size package or if you have a pump or semi-auto shotgun, get an 18" barrel for not too much money. 0 -
Good time to consider the difference between killing and stopping.
If I'm going after something that has the ability to chew on my hide if properly motivated I want a "stopper" not just a "killer". .357 IMHO would be a stunt; unfair to the bear and possibly damaging to you.
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