detachable clip for a ruger 77 mk ll
is one available that drops in to a Hawkeye or a ruger 77 in 375 ruger
thanks
thanks
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Its a "magazine" (not clip).
Since Ruger offers a "Hawkeye African" rifle in .375 Ruger, magazines for these have to exist.
You're probably not going to have an easy time finding a spare one for sale, but I bet Ruger would be happy to sell you one if you contacted them:
Try here:
http://www.ruger.com/footer/contact.html
Edit:
Strictly speaking a "clip" and "magazine" are different things.
Regardless, I just got off the phone with Ruger customer service. They told me the following.
The M77 mk II/Hawkeye MAGAZINE BOX (that's what THEY call this part) is NOT an item you can just order off their website.
If you call their customer service (which is based in New Hampshire) and give them the SERIAL NUMBER of the gun in question, then they will check their inventory and see if they have one in stock to fit the gun in question that they can sell you.
Presumably THIS is the part that you want. The other parts of the magazine include the floorplate, spring, and follower. If you need those other parts, again, you'll have to call and ask for them.
If, instead, you're looking for an aftermarket type detachable magazine for this gun in .375 Ruger, forget it, nobody makes that. If you really want something like that you'd either have to adapt a magazine from a different gun, or alternatively fabricate one yourself from scratch.
EG: http://www.eurooptic.com/krieghoff-semprio-magazine-caliber-375-ruger.aspx
Modifying a standard bolt action rifle to take detachable magazines isn't impossible, but it typically involves quite a bit of design and machining work, and IMO its probably not worth the (likely considerable) expense and effort here.
If you're looking for a true CLIP (ie just something to hold a few rounds together), something like that will be a lot easier to fabricate from scratch or modify from a pre-existing one. For example, Mosin-nagant rifles use a 7.62x54R rimmed cartridge with 14.4mm rims, and Mosin clips are pretty cheap and easy to find. The 375 Ruger rims are 13.5 mm wide. .. maybe you could do something there. But again, probably not worth the effort.
Unfortunately, getting your rifle to load properly from a clip like also probably won't work without modifying the rifle. Creating/installing a functional stripper guide might be easier than remachining the receiver to accept detachable magazines, but again, IMO the entire exercise won't be worth it.0 -
Don't think you are going find a clip, {Yes I called it a clip--just like I call a long sandwich a "hero" and some others call it a "Sub" and others call it a "Hoagie"}, for that gun.
A replacement steel floorplate, yes. A Mag/clip, No.0 -
Ruger does not offer the Hawkeye or M77 with a detachable box magazine for the .375 Ruger cartridge. Savage does though so if you must have a detachable box magazine in that caliber look at the Savage.
http://m.savagearms.com/#/firearms/model/16FCSS,116FCSS0 -
fivebigbores,
Here is a response with photographs which illustrates the difference in those two terms. Scroll down to my response.
http://forums.GunBroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=315744
With regard to your question, if you're asking about detachable box magazines which will fit the existing Ruger bottom metal, the answer unfortunately is no.
Several companies make this system for their own rifles but Ruger has ignored this aspect, at least for the time being. I find it humorous that Savage and of all people, Krieghoff, offer DBM as a standard in the .375 Ruger for at least one model in their line.
Options exist through other manufacturers but if you need to stick with your Ruger, you're out of luck.
Best.0 -
I think Ruger's idea behind no detachable Mag for the .375, [Besides
the trouble making it fit for that shell} stems from the the old
wisdom of "big five guns" must be super reliable.
It was common belief many years ago that the hunter of big dangerous
game needed a second shot without any possibility of malfuntions {such as a mag falling out}.
Hence, Ruger's naming those .375 guns, the "African" and the "Guild".
Names from the golden years of hunting.0 -
quote:Originally posted by babun
I think Ruger's idea behind no detachable Mag for the .375, [Besides
the trouble making it fit for that shell} stems from the the old
wisdom of "big five guns" must be super reliable.
It was common belief many years ago that the hunter of big dangerous
game needed a second shot without any possibility of malfuntions {such as a mag falling out}.
Hence, Ruger's naming those .375 guns, the "African" and the "Guild".
Names from the golden years of hunting.
Exactly.
Just to be clear here for those who might not get it, the "big five" refer to large dangerous African game animals (including lion, leopard, elephant, rhinocerous, and cape buffalo). These guns have to be super reliable because all of these game animals can kill you in a matter of a few seconds, and a misfire can be fatal.
A detachable magazine only increases the possibility that you will accidentally detach a magazine when you don't mean to, or outright lose one. There probably isn't a real world advantage in this particular setting.
As it is, the rifle holds 3 shots, and each shot is a shoulder-busting cannon. Realistically, in the event that you expended your first three rounds, are still alive (!), and needed a fourth one, you'd probably have enough time to reload your gun.
Both the Krieghoff Semprio (itself an interesting modular pump action design) and Savage .375 Ruger magazines still only hold three, so even with the detachable mags, there is no capacity advantage to the other designs.
Swapping out a magazine for the detachable mag guns on the fly probably isn't going to be any faster than say dropping one more round (or maybe even more than one) into the chamber of your non-detachable magazine gun, and in fact is likely slower.
In terms of actual design, I don't think designing a detachable mag system for this caliber is really any fundamentally different/harder than doing it for any other caliber.
If Savage can do it, Ruger can do it. Ruger already makes several other detachable magazine bolt action rifles in other calibers (including a similar Mark II design in .308 winchester) and has been doing so for decades. Ruger "could" figure out a way to do this if they wanted to. . .they just don't want to.0 -
quote:...I don't think designing a detachable mag system for this caliber is really any fundamentally different/harder...
Definition of CALIBER
a : the diameter of a bullet or other projectile
b : the diameter of a bore of a gun usually expressed in hundredths or thousandths of an inch and typically written as a decimal fraction <.32 caliber>
This term 'caliber' gets misused as least as often as the other term 'clip' and probably more frequently. You are not discussing a caliber, you're talking about a CARTRIDGE plain and simple.
Insistence of using a term incorrectly when you aware of the proper term is just being stubborn and confrontational. Or maybe just a slow learner...
Magazines:
While we all yearn for the 'golden days of hunting' and love reading the stories of African safaris, there are real reasons why a company such as Ruger does not develop a magazine system for this Hawkeye African and reliability is not one of them.
Ruger does indeed have a Detachable Box Magazine system (if you can call it that...) which is being used in the Ruger Gunsite Scout Rifle. It's currently limited to the .308 Win. cartridge and this rifle but can be adapted to any of the cartridges using this case such as the .243 Win. and the .260 Rem. with proper rebarreling and chambering. But there is a difference between this design and the designs being used by the rest of the industry.
Ruger utilizes their proprietary angled front action screw for this rifle. To use their DBM, you have to use a nylon trigger guard/magazine well combination insert and the special clip/screw used to attach the front of this trigger guard to the rifle and action through the stock. The geometry of this angled screw prevents using standardized DBM systems. All of the rest of the industry uses screws which are perpendicular to the stock, which allows for a standardized trigger guard/mag well with both both points of attachment integral. In essence, you remove the original bottom metal and replace it with the new DBM and Voile! Some of the DMBs require additional inletting in the stock to accommodate the new systems with double stack feeding.
Reliability and Safety
Rather than reiterate what has already been stated in other articles, I ask that you spend a couple of minutes reading this article at the supplied link:
http://www.shootingvoodoo.com/index.php/articles/detachable_magazines/
Virtually all of us who compete in Tactical and long range competitions, use DBM systems of one make or another. Like any other piece of equipment we use, magazines continue to function so long as you check and maintain them. All of the systems I've run will work with the .375 Ruger cartridge. If Ruger won't solve their problem, get a new rifle.
Best.0 -
fivebigbores,
You have been given the right information for the Ruger system, from Nononsense. As he describes their proprietary, angled front screw, it is not impossible to fit your rifle with the bottom metal/magazine system from Accuracy International, or something like the Badger M-5 system(which I have a couple rifles, although not a Ruger with this system). It would require modification of your rifles action, and the stock. Cost wise, it would be almost more worth while to buy a custom rifle with this.
A good gunsmith/rifle builder, such as Nononsense, Would be able to use the system from Savage, or any other manufacturer as well...even though it would be very tedious.
As for this...
quote:A detachable magazine only increases the possibility that you will accidentally detach a magazine when you don't mean to, or outright lose one. There probably isn't a real world advantage in this particular setting.
On the M-5 and AI systems, there is a much better chance of you retaining your ammunition , where it belongs, than with the standard Ruger/Remington/Savage/Winchester hinged floor plate systems. Yes, I have seen heavy recoiling rifles drop out the floor plate. Actually, I have had it happen, with a Remington 700 BDL, and a Winchester Model 70, while shooting at a deer. Thank goodness there was no second shot needed.
As an aside, for reliability sake, and hunting the big 5, is why most serious professional hunter/African guides, carry a large bore double rifle.
Best
EDIT 1
Think of what you are saying here...
quote:Anyway, Ruger did just introduce its new "American Rifle" platform that takes detachable magazines by design. They don't offer one in .375 Ruger but presumably if they perceived enough commercial demand for a detachable mag bolt action rifle for that cartridge, they could and would do so.
Ruger did not introduce a damn thing there, they copied it from Savage(Axis), or acquired it from the folks supplying Savage.
Also Ruger's 77-22/17/22mag/357/44...hmmmm....that all started because they wanted/needed a bolt action counterpart for the 10-22, so that is what they done...made the rifle around the magazine, then for the subsequently larger chambered versions, they enlarged the magazine, and the action.
I am not saying Ruger does not have the amount of french fries in their happy meal to design their own, but what is taking them so long? Seems like they are as stubborn, as when Bill was there, not wanting an accessory rail on HIS semi-auto "P" series pistols.
Best0 -
quote:Ruger does indeed have a Detachable Box Magazine system (if you can call it that...) which is being used in the Ruger Gunsite Scout Rifle. It's currently limited to the .308 Win. cartridge and this rifle but can be adapted to any of the cartridges using this case such as the .243 Win. and the .260 Rem. with proper rebarreling and chambering. Why "can't" you call it that?
Just for completeness sake, Ruger also offers detachable magazine systems for its model 77 platform rifles in .44 magnum, .357 magnum, and .22LR, and has for quite some time, though these are rotary systems in these cases intended for rimmed cartridges.
quote:This term 'caliber' gets misused as least as often as the other term 'clip' and probably more frequently. You are not discussing a caliber, you're talking about a CARTRIDGE plain and simple.
Insistence of using a term incorrectly when you aware of the proper term is just being stubborn and confrontational. Or maybe just a slow learner...You're right, "cartridge" is the correct term here; no need for the name calling.
On the rest of it, I submit to you that Ruger doesn't make a detachable mag system for this particular CARTRIDGE/rifle platform not because they "can't" overcome a geometrical issue with action screws if they really wanted to, but mostly because there isn't enough commercial demand for detachable magazines here to justify the large expense of redesign and retooling necessary to do it. Ruger 77 is a 40 year old hunting platform; it works fine for that purpose and Ruger likely sees no reason to change it now.
As you know, the whole point of the 375 Ruger cartridge (which was designed in collaboration with Ruger to begin with) is to replicate the ballistics of a proven African large game hunting cartridge in a conventional length action that can be easily adapted to pre-existing rifle platforms.
The goal was mostly to create an "affordable" large game rifle and for Ruger, the logical choice was to adapt this cartridge into its model 77, a popular, tried and true design (rather than creating a new platform).
Citing the article you posted (which is excellent, by the way):
quote:One of the major factors that determine the utility of a DM system to a civilian shooter is of course the type of shooting that they will be doing. In all honesty, the typical hunter probably has very little use for a $300+ detachable magazine system if they are only using factory hunting ammunition in their rifle a couple weeks out of the year.
I think that sums this up pretty well. So far as I know, nobody uses a 375 Ruger for competitive shooting, sniping, or military use; its a pure large game hunting cartridge. The name "M77 African" isn't just some nostalgic throwback to the African Safari days, the whole point of the rifle is for is gun is for large/dangerous game rifle hunting, including African game.
So again, in a pure hunting setting, most of the advantages of detachable magazines (eg faster reloads, higher capacity, ability to quickly swap out different types of ammo, etc) are muted. I agree that with proper design a detachable magazine system doesn't have to be any less mechanically reliable than a fixed one, but they are typically more complex and expensive, and both those things are potential disadvantages.
Anyway, Ruger did just introduce its new "American Rifle" platform that takes detachable magazines by design. They don't offer one in .375 Ruger but presumably if they perceived enough commercial demand for a detachable mag bolt action rifle for that cartridge, they could and would do so.
EDIT:
quote:TSR1965:
Ruger did not introduce a damn thing there, they copied it from Savage(Axis), or acquired it from the folks supplying Savage.
Well, the Ruger 77 itself is just a tweaked Mauser, right? Anyway, not disagreeing, maybe its better to leave the opining about Ruger's innovations (or lack thereof) to a different place. I'd assume they came up with their "American Rifle" for pure business reasons. . .IE they're trying to get a piece of the market that the low-cost Savage rifles occupy.
Not sure anyone really does, but the point is, if you really need a detachable magazine .375 Ruger rifle from Ruger, its more probable that you'll see one built on their newer platform before the legacy one, that's all.
Why hasn't Ruger made a detachable magazine system for its "flagship" rifle? I think the answer is that they have. . .for the one model that probably "needs" it most. For the others, I just don't think there is enough demand to be worth it for them.0 -
bts,
Just a couple of quick point to wrap this up.
First, there was no name calling. That one reference was towards another post involving the term 'clip'.
Second, no matter what defense is mounted for Ruger, their idea of a DBM 'system' is an insert made from nylon which is held in place by their addition of a clip to control the insert and the angle screw. This is just not what the industry acknowledges as reliable because the nylon will change shape in heat. I know, I know, you want to be right about your opinion but this one is a loser from the get go. Why? I work with hundreds of these systems each year and they don't fail but keep working as they were designed to, all the way up through the .338 Lapua and the Chey-Tac family. Not enough demand? Not for the Ruger products is all. The industry uses thousands of these DBM systems a year for every make except Ruger.
Anyway, it's fun to kick this stuff around but on to the next topic.
Best.0
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