M-1 carbine
I know this is scant info, but can anyone give me an idea of what an M-1 carbine made in Saginaw in about 80% condition would be worth assuming all the numbers match? Were any of the reproductions made in Saginaw? Again sketchy info, but would like to know before I go to pains to track this down.....
Thanks,
Dan
Thanks,
Dan
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What are the posibilites of turning a .30 cal. carbine into a .38 super? 0 -
After the war, when a bunch of folks. Wound up with G.I. guns, that had been liberated, by 5 finger discount. They got cold feet, and figured. If they removed the serial number, and all G.I. markings. Nobody could prove, that it had been stolen from Uncle Sam. They probably didn't know, that any gun with a altered or removed S.N. is verboten. In and of itself, no mater it's origin. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by rufe-snow
After the war, when a bunch of folks. Wound up with G.I. guns, that had been liberated, by 5 finger discount. They got cold feet, and figured. If they removed the serial number, and all G.I. markings. Nobody could prove, that it had been stolen from Uncle Sam. They probably didn't know, that any gun with a altered or removed S.N. is verboten. In and of itself, no mater it's origin.
Yep, exactly. Even if the firearm was passed onto someone else, by sale, or otherwise, the one holding the gun, is the one charged with defacing the serial number.0 -
I am often wrong...
But I am pretty certain. The batfe has allowances and provisions for this...
If the number can be revealed or raised I by the correct forensic techniques....
And authorized party or certified expert may be allowed to restore or restamp under a specific strict controlled set of promulgated guidelines.
Fraught with peril of not done within the law.
Mike0 -
quote:Originally posted by mrmike08075
I am often wrong...
But I am pretty certain. The batfe has allowances and provisions for this...
If the number can be revealed or raised I by the correct forensic techniques....
And authorized party or certified expert may be allowed to restore or restamp under a specific strict controlled set of promulgated guidelines.
Fraught with peril of not done within the law.
Mike
Well I do not know if the Gestapo will allow a s/n to be restored, but the law states that it is illegal to be in possession of a firearm that has had the s/n removed or defaced.0 -
Remember, prior to 1968, no serial number was required.. In the late '50's, to the mid '60's, there were many commercial carbines.. The inter-relationship of manufacturers and owners was mind-boggling.. Read the history on those of that time period,,
http://www.m1carbinesinc.com/carbines.html
The Shotgun News, and every gun show offered them.. Every finished carbine I saw, or owned, was serial numbered, and marked as to manufacturer, however not all were.. When a company died, the parts inventory was cast to the wind.. Some receivers were marked, many were not.. We all feared what the '68 law would entail.. I was just starting college, and certainly didn't want any issues.. I kept all the parts I had, but sold a 50 cal. ammo can full of fresh, un-marked receivers to a gunsmith.. I had purchased them from A Shotgun News ad, direct from the shop that forged them, and got stuck with them when the retail company went belly-up..
What you may have seen is a commercial receiver with the serial number in a different location-maybe even under the stock.. Every gunsmith/builder I knew, that used these parts, would stamp a serial number on it prior to sale.. No one wanted to risk trying to prove its date of manufacture..0 -
quote:Originally posted by Hangfire
Remember, prior to 1968, no serial number was required.. In the late '50's, to the mid '60's, there were many commercial carbines.. The inter-relationship of manufacturers and owners was mind-boggling.. Read the history on those of that time period,,
http://www.m1carbinesinc.com/carbines.html
The Shotgun News, and every gun show offered them.. Every finished carbine I saw, or owned, was serial numbered, and marked as to manufacturer, however not all were.. When a company died, the parts inventory was cast to the wind.. Some receivers were marked, many were not.. We all feared what the '68 law would entail.. I was just starting college, and certainly didn't want any issues.. I kept all the parts I had, but sold a 50 cal. ammo can full of fresh, un-marked receivers to a gunsmith.. I had purchased them from A Shotgun News ad, direct from the shop that forged them, and got stuck with them when the retail company went belly-up..
What you may have seen is a commercial receiver with the serial number in a different location-maybe even under the stock.. Every gunsmith/builder I knew, that used these parts, would stamp a serial number on it prior to sale.. No one wanted to risk trying to prove its date of manufacture..
Expanding on Hangfires post. There are 80% firearm receivers, manufactured for personal use. If you were to buy one, finish the receiver. And then build it out, to a complete and functioning firearm. There is no federal requirement, that it had a serial number. As long as it remains in your possession.( Although I understand the great state of California, now requires their sheeple. To have self built firearms serial numbered.)
From Dodge69's original post, don't believe the above is applicable though. It seems that the carbine he is referring to, is a GI. Made during the war.0 -
USGI receivers were forged AND MILLED. It's pretty much impossible to remove the serial number(s) without being obvious to someone familiar with them.
Without photos, we really have no way to identify the receiver that dodge69 saw. It could be a commercial cast receiver, & it could be a USGI receiver.
And, as rufe-snow said, possession of a firearm with an altered or removed SN is illegal, even for firearms made before they were required.
Some USGI carbines will have the same SN stamped twice on the receiver. When adjustable sights were installed, some carbines with the SN under the sight overhang had the SN re-stamped at a military arsenal.
Neal0 -
The carbine I was looking at was indeed made in the war years, at least the barrel was as it was marked Underwood 7-43 with the bomb right under the date.
The story was the gun had been taken to the Hwy patrol some years ago and the numbers raised but they were stamped to the recoil plate not the receiver which made no sense to me. Of course the table guy knew all this as the gun actually belonged to a good friend who recently passed.0 -
OK :
There is NO WAY I would have a firearm with a "REMOVED" (altered) serial number :
Its just that simple ...
I know how the alphabet police can be ......
Thanks !!!0 -
Couple of problems there.
The recoil plate is a separate part, the receiver must bear the serial number.
The Highway Patrol is not an authorized agency to renumber guns, that has to go through BATF.
It is highly unlikely that "Grandpa's Army Gun" which is really stolen government property would be approved for renumbering.
Does that mean that BATF SWAT is going to raid everybody who admits to holding a "scrubbed" pilfered service weapon?
No.
What it does mean is that no KNOWLEDGEABLE dealer or collector will touch it, and that in a country anticipating UBC and other forms of registration, it will become less and less desirable to have around.0 -
There's not a gun in the world where I would risk spending 10 years in Club Fed. [:0] 0
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