Tepliti ? Shotgun
Hi. I'm looking for information and reasonable value for a collection I've been asked to help liquidate. Most I've been able to get an idea from internet searches and 17th Edition of Gun Digest. This one eludes me.
It is a 12 gauge, double barrel shotgun.SN(?)-739.02.17 3 17 2- 45" total, 28.25" barrel. It's marked "Franz Theile Tepliti" on top of barrels. Other marks-
"Nicht Fur Kugel" (not for ball?), 1960.02, 'D, .SS, 17.2 -all under barrel. Also "Prima Wittener Gewehrlaufstahl" (Prime Wittener Shotgun Steel ?) over an eagle(?) with anchors. Hopefully the pictures will be adequate to show detail.
It is a 12 gauge, double barrel shotgun.SN(?)-739.02.17 3 17 2- 45" total, 28.25" barrel. It's marked "Franz Theile Tepliti" on top of barrels. Other marks-
"Nicht Fur Kugel" (not for ball?), 1960.02, 'D, .SS, 17.2 -all under barrel. Also "Prima Wittener Gewehrlaufstahl" (Prime Wittener Shotgun Steel ?) over an eagle(?) with anchors. Hopefully the pictures will be adequate to show detail.
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You need way better pic's. It looks valuable so get a pro to take them. You will likely need them for insurance and to sell it online, where the market is best for this kind of item.
Google found this one. https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.guns/5trS6aH_pPc
and this under teplitz
https://www.dorotheum.com/auktionen/aktuelle-auktionen/kataloge/list-lots-detail/auktion/12010-jagd-sport-und-sammlerwaffen/lotID/17/lot/2109521-doppelflinte-franz-thiele-teplitz-kal-16-vermutlich-1665.html0 -
quote:Originally posted by charliemeyer007
You need way better pic's. It looks valuable so get a pro to take them. You will likely need them for insurance and to sell it online, where the market is best for this kind of item.
Suspected as much. Just cellphone pics I fired off real quick to try to get an idea. I'll try to get some better pics in ASAP. Thanks!0 -
The proof marks seem German to me? But the makers name and location don't show up in any of my research?
The standard way, these high grade custom guns are marked. Is that the maker/gunsmith would be Franz Theile, located in the town of Tepliti.
This doesn't square with the apparent dated proof mark 1960.2 = Febuary 1960.
As by that date Tepliti was a town in Czechoslovakia, with the name spelled differently. This was because after the war ended in 1945, all the ethnic Germans were run out of Czechoslovakia. Besides the names of the towns, reverting to the the Czech names and spelling.
All I can think of is the shotguns barrels with the "Tepliti" markings were made before the war? But assembled into a completely different shotgun in West Germany after the war.
This might or might not? Increase it's value to a European collector.0 -
TxDerringer,
Here is another shotgun similar by nature. Some of the information at the bottom will get you going on the gunsmith. The 1960.02 is the serial number. I have posted both the German original and the online translation.
Doppelflinte, Franz Thiele - Teplitz, Kal.: 16 (vermutlich 16/65),
Nr.: 616.09, Laufl?nge: 682 mm, Gewicht: 2860 g, doppelte Laufhakenverriegelung und Schienenverl?ngerung mit 'Greener'-Verschlu?, Doppelabzug, automatische Kolbenhalssicherung (im gesicherten Zustand ist der in Gold eingelegte Schriftzug: 'SICHER' erkennbar), 'Blitz'-System, Ejektor, grau gebeizte Bask?le und Z?ngelplatte sowie br?nierter Schl?ssel, Vorderteil und Abzugsb?gel mit zeitgen?ssischer Randstich-, Rosetten-, Arabesken- und Tierst?ckgravur, die Laufschiene beschriftet mit FRANZ THIELE TEPLITZ', die Laufoberseite beschriftet mit der Stahlmarke und der Pr?fung, das Laufb?ndel br?niert und im Bereich der Laufwurzel mit ornamental eingelegtem Goldfaden, der Schaft aus Nu?holz mit Pistolengriff, Fischhaut, Deutscher Backe und Gummikappe, Riemenb?gel, Schaftl?nge: 370 mm, gebraucht, guter Erhaltungszustand, die Br?nierung sehr gut erhalten, die L?ufe innen in gutem Zustand und nur leicht fleckig, das Laufb?ndel mit leichtem Spiel in der Bask?le, der Schaft mit Gebrauchsspuren, Weiperter Beschu? aus dem Jahr 1909, seltene und technisch interessante Sammlerwaffe ohne g?ltigen Beschu? A+M
Franz Thiele ?bernahm vermutlich in den sp?ten 1870er- oder fr?hen 1880er-Jahren die Werkst?tte von Anton Czischek (geb. 1843, als B?chsenmacher in den 1860er-Jahren erw?hnt). Er war Gewinner vieler Auszeichnungen und auch ein hervorragender Sch?tze. So gewann er die Schie?wettbewerbe in Karlsbad in den Jahren 1900, 1903, 1905, 1907 und 1908. Mit Ausbruch des 1. WK wird er nicht mehr erw?hnt.
Online translator:
Doppelflinte, Franz Thiele - Teplice, cal: 16 16/65 (probably),
no: 616.09, run length: 682 mm, Weight: 2860 g, double-hook locking and rail extension with 'greener' shutter, double deduction, automatic piston neck fuse (in the saved state is loaded in gold lettering: 'SAFE' is visible), 'Flash' system, ejector, gray pickled baskule and zungelplatte and burnished key, front part and trigger guard with a contemporary edge stitch, rosettes, arabesque and animal piece of engraving, the slide rail labeled WITH FRANZ THIELE TEPLICE', the run top labeled with the steel brand and the check, the barrel browned and in the area of running root with ornamental inlayed gold thread, the shaft is made from walnut wood with pistol grip, fish skin, German jaw and rubber cap, Belt Clip, Shaft length: 370 mm, used, in a good state of preservation, the browning very well preserved, the course in good condition and only slightly stained, the barrel With a slight clearance in the Baskule, the shank with traces of use, Weiperter bombardment from the year 1909, rare and technically interesting collectors weapon without a valid attack A M
Franz Thiele was probably in the late 1870s or early 1880s the workshop by Anton Czischek (born 1843, as a gunsmith in the 1860's mentioned). He was a winner of many awards and is also an outstanding contactors. So he won the shooting competitions in Karlovy Vary in the years 1900, 1903, 1905, 1907 and 1908. With the outbreak of the 1. WK it is no longer mentioned.
Make of it as you will.
Best.0 -
nice looking old gun If you put up for auction here come back and give us the auction NUMBER 0 -
Hello - you can tell by my screen name that I have a shotgun or two. The most expensive shotgun I could ever do is an Antonio Zoli. This one is way above that. You need someone who is knowledgeable to do an evaluation. Unfortunately Captain Kirk - Kirk Stillwater is no longer with us. Dr. Frank Latimer - Saxon Pig - Arkansas - has not posted in about 10 years. There are others here on GunBroker who are capable of doing an evaluation - but most if not all will want to have the shotgun in hand - and not pictures, Best Regards - AQH 0 -
Thanks for all the information! Obviously valuing this gun is going to be a tad more involved than I thought. According to the list I'm working off, it was a "bird gun" purchased at a gun show in '98 for $600.00 with no other information. Guy bought it and stuck it in a safe where it's sat since. Hopefully it ends up being worth at least what he spent on it 18 yrs ago! I'll post some better pics and I'm looking to see if there's a knowledgeable appraiser in my area. And yes I intend to list it through GunBroker.com!
Again thanks for the expertise!0
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