73 Win 44-40
I have a "73" 44-40 that is 135 yrs old that looks to have a better than usual bore for well used rifle of that age. Has very visible rifling.
Shooting .430 200 gr lead bullets and accuracy is terrible. At 25 yrds. 4" right & 5" low with keyhole strikes.
Would going to a 240gr bullet which would be longer help with that problem?
Shooting .430 200 gr lead bullets and accuracy is terrible. At 25 yrds. 4" right & 5" low with keyhole strikes.
Would going to a 240gr bullet which would be longer help with that problem?
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Keyholeing usually means an undersize bullet not being stabilized. You might try compressing a few bullets in a vise to expand them a few thousands and test them. A quick, cheap way to see if a larger diameter is required. I have never done that but have seen it recommended. 0 -
Keyhole to me means the bullet isn't taking the rifling or the bullet is to long to stabilize.
Slug the bore after cleaning it really good (several times with soaking time in between). Bullets .001 -.002 oversize is usually good. Shooter's Choice does a good job at cutting lead out for me. Bronze or brass brush maybe.
Original size was .427 so .430 might be part of the problem. 200 gr should work, perhaps 180 would be a better direction over 240. Loading to hot can cause the lead to strip - maybe try some Cowboy loads if you are shooting factory ammo. Choice of bullet lube can be important - hard stuff like Rooster Red is worthless IMHO.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.44-40_Winchester
added So I looked in my Lyman 49th edition
Starting load in a 44-40 pistol using the 200 gr 427666 sized to .429 is 5.5 gr of Trail Boss.
Loading data for a 44-40 rifle doesn't list Trail Boss. Cast bullets were sized to .429. Unique is listed and one of my first choices for lead bullets. Soft lead and a soft lube would be good.0 -
Have you tried slugging the bore? You might need to swage the bullets to a larger diameter.
Longer & heavier bullets will not fix your problem if you continue to use the same diameter. In fact, the 240-gr bullet is likely to be less accurate, as it will begin to tumble more quickly than the 200-gr bullet.0 -
Keyholing is not an uncommon problem with many old guns. Bore diameter when new varied gun to gun a lot more than it does with modern guns. And different manufactures had their own ideas of what the nominal bore diameter should be. Try to get lead bullets that are about 0.002 inch larger than the bore after you slug it.
Another issue: I have seen a lot of old lever guns that keyholed because of bore wear at and just inside the muzzle. Presumably this was often caused by aggressive use of a cleaning rod from the muzzle end.0 -
One potential problem is that if you have a large groove diameter, bullets made to fill the grooves plus a thou or two may yield cartridge necks too large to chamber.
When I was working up a .44-40 rifle and revolver for CAS. I found that Winchester brass was the thinnest and would let me use a larger bullet than Remington. Starline was in between.0 -
I am using cowboy loads. 5 gr of Trail Boss powder. So you think a smaller bullet? I had some .427's at one time. I'll see if I still have some around. 0 -
Larger diameter would probably be better than smaller but if you already have .430" I don't know about the chamber neck clearance.
5 gr of Trail Boss is below the Hodgdon starting load for .44-40-200.
You may be "lobbing" the bullets as Jim Clark said of loads too light for accuracy.
https://www.hodgdon.com/trail-boss/
Note: Hodgdon lists .44-40 as a pistol cartridge. Riiight.0 -
as others have stated bore size is a problem in many older rifles
I love the older COLT Lightning pump rifles and have tried shooting them in Cowboy matches I have a 3220 that the bore looks as close to new however it would shoot 12 inch groups at 25 yards 4 with over 50 % key hole 50 yards would not hold paper on 24 X 24 inch target Because I also shout a 32 S&W long in a Match pistol I measured theColt rifle barrel for bore size it was .319[:(][V]I loaded some rifle shells with the hollow base wadcutter 32S&W bullets i used in my pistol into the rifle cases it the colt lightning would then shoot 1/2 inch groups at 50 yards how ever the loaded rounds did not want to feed unless you worked the pump action very slowly I could never find round nose 32/20 bullets in 319 diameter I TRIED some bullets That I had tried to SWAGE up to 319 but they could not be fitted in the current 32/20 cases & then chamber . I think a HEALED bullet would work like was used in a 41cal colt pistol . if that design was available in 32/20
sit is a shame no one makes a hollow base round nose0 -
perry, I had the same problem with a .310 martini, bore dia. of .319. I used .32 special bullets for 'rifle' loads and found a mold for the .31 cal. colt 'pocket' revolvers that works as a 'healed' bullet. a crimp die from lee and all was well. 0 -
OK I messed with the rifle on Sat. The ammo I was using was .427, not .430. Didn't have the box marked very well. Shot some .430 through it & solved the keyhole problem, but accuracy is still terrible. Looked at a fired bullet & could see rifling marks on one side of bullet. The other side looked like it slid down a piece of pipe. Took a closer look at the bore & at the muzzle like Truthful said. One side is worn down. The bullet size thing, I have a 73 in 32-20 that factory ammo key holed. Reloaded with slightly larger bullets & made it very accurate. Have an 1886 in 40-82 with the same issue & solved problem the same way. I hoped once the key hole problem solved the accuracy would follow but no. 0
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