Ok rifle scope question
I got one in a package deal a some what nice burris . but honestly have never used one or talked to any one who has one . just the photos or gun shows when they show a cooper scout rifle and similar ?
any input (and that is including the normal interesting answers at random )
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fast target aquisition 0 -
wanted to say thanks for the responses before I go to bed
along the lines of my guessing as to why I guess I did not think about faster targeting0 -
As far as I'm concerned the ONLY advantage is being able to stripper clip load a bolt action. Not something I've really ever needed. I have 3 old Mausers set up with rear sight mounted LER low magnification scopes and have used them a bit but see no advantage other than I didn't have to send them off to be D&T.
Last year, I bought a LER scope by mistake(didn't read the description close enough). After considerable cussing, I decided to mount the scope on an AR pistol in order to at least get some use from the scope. It didn't work too bad so it's still in place but that's a pretty narrow use niche.0 -
It goes to the "Scout Rifle" concept of Jeff Cooper. I cannot speak to the military uses of a "scout rifle" and can see where long eye relief is essential on hunting or maybe target handguns, but I see little or no real purpose for a "scout rifle in hunting, thus little use for the scope. 0 -
I am one of the dissenters that never bought into the scoped scout rifle concept. I do like the short barrel and detachable mags, but trying to quickly acquire a target thru a LER scope is not something one cannot do quickly. Short range & quick shooting -- iron sights are best. 0 -
I've used a scout scope set up on slug guns and it worked pretty well. IIRC Forge posted some pictures of a friend's scout rifle set up with a couple of elk he had taken. 0 -
Wouldn't any scope you have, be a "scout scope set up"??.....SCOUT5 said:I've used a scout scope set up on slug guns and it worked pretty well. IIRC Forge posted some pictures of a friend's scout rifle set up with a couple of elk he had taken.
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toad67 said:
Wouldn't any scope you have, be a "scout scope set up"??.....SCOUT5 said:I've used a scout scope set up on slug guns and it worked pretty well. IIRC Forge posted some pictures of a friend's scout rifle set up with a couple of elk he had taken.
that's goodtoad67 said:
Wouldn't any scope you have, be a "scout scope set up"??.....SCOUT5 said:I've used a scout scope set up on slug guns and it worked pretty well. IIRC Forge posted some pictures of a friend's scout rifle set up with a couple of elk he had taken.
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I think Coopers theory was that many times a quick good shot was better than a slow perfect shot. 0 -
Plus, only works if you keep both eyes open.mohawk600 said:fast target aquisition0 -
Learn to shoot with both eyes open. One eye looks through the scope image, the other gives a real-world wide-angle view. With practice your brain will learn to switch back and forth. 0 -
truthful said:Learn to shoot with both eyes open. One eye looks through the scope image, the other gives a real-world wide-angle view. With practice your brain will learn to switch back and forth.
You must be very young.
Teaching old brains new tricks with fading eyes, slower synaptic responses and just plain old stubbornness makes for a tough row to hoe.0 -
I have Mauser model K98 k with a ZF Zielvier 4x standard eye relief steel tube external adjustment scope on claw turrets (high mount) (bnz 41) attributed to Panzer grenadiers purportedly recovered at St. Vith following TBOTB (just up the road from Bastognne)
‘Zielvier’ is an abbreviation from ‘Zielfernrohr mit vierfach Vergroesserung’, or a Sighting Telescope with Four-power Magnification, so a literal translation of the Zielvier would be something like “Scopefour”, and not just ‘4-power’. And it was really not a nickname, but a pre-war commercial name of a series of Zeiss scopes: other than Zielvier (4x) there was also a Zielsechs (6x)
I have Mauser BYF42 rifle (SS rune along with standard waffenampt proof and witness marks) with a ZF-41 tiny / diminutive long eye relief forward of the receiver overhang steel tube twin pin adjustment on low height close paired mount (purportedly recovered in Italy just north of the Vatican)
The ZF-41 was a tiny 1.5x optic made in large numbers by Germany during WWII. It is a long eye relief design, mounting over the rear sight of a K98k, and allowing unimpeded access for stripper clips for reloading. These scopes are generally though to have been complete failures, and a huge disappointment to German snipers.
Well, they were disappointing to snipers – but that is because they were never intended to be used by snipers. The ZF-41 was an early example of a designated marksman’s optic – something to allow the best shot in a squad to get that little extra capability to make tricky shots. It was put into service with snipers because it was available in much greater numbers than proper 4x sniper scopes, and couple be easily added to a rifle in the field.
It's not uncommon to see this set up mounted on carbines issued to engineers or artillery or mountain / forestry / littoral designated (naval infantry) units in south America and a few other places of interest.
Mike
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I have one on a Ruger Scout .450 Bushmaster caliber for deer hunting..only rifle I have that I can shoot looking thru a scope [scout mnt] with both eyes open...Im right eye dominant also.. 0 -
Well, it IS real hard to get hit in the eye with the scope on a Scout rifle...….. 0 -
add in being a right hand shooter and strongly left eye dominant and you've really got issues!bpost said:truthful said:Learn to shoot with both eyes open. One eye looks through the scope image, the other gives a real-world wide-angle view. With practice your brain will learn to switch back and forth.
You must be very young.
Teaching old brains new tricks with fading eyes, slower synaptic responses and just plain old stubbornness makes for a tough row to hoe.0 -
So as many of you know or perhaps have surmised I have made a study of sniper rifles and designated marksmen proofed primary main issue TOE long arms over the acquisition - detailed curatorial research phase - and heavy participation in sanctioned for the record active competition circuit of events...
I have had the opportunity to own and shoot multiple variations (3 pieces as a rule when possible) of such rifles from many manufacturers and countries - from approximately 1880 to the late 1970's...
I also have a penchant for carbines and short rifles issued to specialized small units like engineers and grenadiers and forestry services and lighthouse / maritime rescue or port security troops - border guards - gendarmes - fusiliers - light infantry mountain troops - military police or provost - postal security - embassy security - military advisory groups - merchant marine - fixed defense and fortifications troops - forward area transportation troops - Swiss guards serving as Vatican defense forces - communication and elint troops - etc...
For some reason the senior NCO's from such units appear almost universally arrange for mint condition national match or "star" grade or armory acceptance "hand select" grade - or designated for target and competition usage / superior measurable tolerance noted during inspection pieces...
An inexplicable / inordinate overwhelming percentage of these aforementioned / above referenced issued arms end up being carbines or short rifles set up for or already affixed with optical devices or having been balanced / blueprinted / Smith or armourer tuned for match target usage and / or graded as superior or star grade or guns receiving an "NM" or "Star" witness marked identification proof.
Forward mounted long eye relief scout rifle variants mounting a scope or other optical enhancement are prevalent and include alternate device like red dot or green dot or holosight units - light projecting acquisition aids - pave penny designation capability - compact protected optical devices similar to the Warner swazey optic early enhancement units on through thermal detection units and gen. 5 NVG items or low power secondary enhancement value added support devices...
Mike
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