Texas Chuch Shooting
My thoughts on the White Settlement Texas Chuch Shooting
The media points out the the guy was shot by an usher. They still make it sound like a ragtag bunch of old guys who carry pistols to church. Here's what it looks like to me.
1. They ushers were trained. Does that make them law enforcement? No. But they probably have sat down and discussed the potential of an active shooter.
2. They have the what, when and where down fairly precise to Sunday morning during a service and inside the foyer or sanctuary.
3. The ushers are on patrol during the service. I suspect many churches keep 2-4 ushers in the foyer on patrol during the service as a frontline for anyone unsavory coming in while the service is in progress.
4. If I was creating an action plan, I'd also keep two ushers guarding the back doors during the service but inside the sanctuary. Also, during the sefvice, the back doors to the sanctuary would be closed but not locked.
I see no reason why this church wasn't practicing these basic measures. It's safe to guess they probably were.
5. Suppose someone who looks odd, potentially unsavory, and potentially a shooter comes in before the survice starts. Where do you want that person to sit? Somewhere on the side. Not in the middle. Where was this guy sitting? On the side. For lack of a better analogy, like cattle, it's easier to herd the guy towards an exit and out along a wall. His movements are a bit more predictable.
6. It's been said they had eyes on him throughout the service. He probably new it. It was probably obvious. Who knows what went on, but the incident happened during communion. Most protestant churches do communion at the end of the service. That means they made it through most of the service. Without an incident. Good job.
Unfortunately, the 2 ushers who were shot were blocking the exit. That created the confrontation. If the guy had a clear path to the exit, would he have fled and not shit anyone. Possible.
Even still, by that point, the shooter was surrounded.
If this analysis is close to correct, I'll speculate as an armchair quarterback that they had a decent plan and most of the parishioners were oblivious and unaware. A good plan should be passive. No one wants obvious signs of force and muscle at a church service. Security needs to blend in.
How many churches have an active shooter action plan? Shouldn't it start at the front door, foyer, and also the sanctuary? Shouldn't such a plan not be simply reactionary but preventive?
What's the weakness of a church security plan? Look at the Christ Church New Zealand mosque. The shooter comes through the door with a shot gun and blasts his way in, then converts to a rifle.
Should church ushers be issued bulletproof vests?
The media points out the the guy was shot by an usher. They still make it sound like a ragtag bunch of old guys who carry pistols to church. Here's what it looks like to me.
1. They ushers were trained. Does that make them law enforcement? No. But they probably have sat down and discussed the potential of an active shooter.
2. They have the what, when and where down fairly precise to Sunday morning during a service and inside the foyer or sanctuary.
3. The ushers are on patrol during the service. I suspect many churches keep 2-4 ushers in the foyer on patrol during the service as a frontline for anyone unsavory coming in while the service is in progress.
4. If I was creating an action plan, I'd also keep two ushers guarding the back doors during the service but inside the sanctuary. Also, during the sefvice, the back doors to the sanctuary would be closed but not locked.
I see no reason why this church wasn't practicing these basic measures. It's safe to guess they probably were.
5. Suppose someone who looks odd, potentially unsavory, and potentially a shooter comes in before the survice starts. Where do you want that person to sit? Somewhere on the side. Not in the middle. Where was this guy sitting? On the side. For lack of a better analogy, like cattle, it's easier to herd the guy towards an exit and out along a wall. His movements are a bit more predictable.
6. It's been said they had eyes on him throughout the service. He probably new it. It was probably obvious. Who knows what went on, but the incident happened during communion. Most protestant churches do communion at the end of the service. That means they made it through most of the service. Without an incident. Good job.
Unfortunately, the 2 ushers who were shot were blocking the exit. That created the confrontation. If the guy had a clear path to the exit, would he have fled and not shit anyone. Possible.
Even still, by that point, the shooter was surrounded.
If this analysis is close to correct, I'll speculate as an armchair quarterback that they had a decent plan and most of the parishioners were oblivious and unaware. A good plan should be passive. No one wants obvious signs of force and muscle at a church service. Security needs to blend in.
How many churches have an active shooter action plan? Shouldn't it start at the front door, foyer, and also the sanctuary? Shouldn't such a plan not be simply reactionary but preventive?
What's the weakness of a church security plan? Look at the Christ Church New Zealand mosque. The shooter comes through the door with a shot gun and blasts his way in, then converts to a rifle.
Should church ushers be issued bulletproof vests?
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I guess I see this situation as an emergency action plan where you largely know the who, what when and where. A proper reaction can be planned out. The opponent is irrational and crazy. They aren't the smartest of people. It's possible to get the upper hand on these situations. Having armed ushers is just a part of it and the last part. 0 -
I don't go to church but if I did I would be armed and I would sit at the back to the side. Most people when they enter or leave go up the middle. 0 -
Part of my job as a fire inspector is inspecting "houses of worship", which we try to do annually. I probably inspect 40-50 a year. The only thing of which I am certain is: no two churches are alike, so there is no way for someone to sit at a computer & write a security plan that works for every church. Some of my churches hire off duty LEO's, some put together a group of members with firearms or LE experience, while other just pray to be spared.
One of my churches came up with a novel solution to deal with "creepy loners", such as the guy who invaded the White Settlement Church. They issue "membership cards" to all members; when a stranger shows up at the door when services are being held, they refuse him admission. They have him fill out an application, photocopy his ID, & send off for a background check; if he passes, they give him a membership card the following week.
There is no perfect solution to the security problem. There are too many psychopaths running around, when they should be in mental institutions. But, our legislators continue to ignore that problem, focusing instead on confiscating the guns of good citizens.
Neal0 -
I believe it was Elizabeth Warren who said he wouldn't feel comfortable being in church with armed patrons.
Hell, she best get out of D.C. where the halls of Congress are filled with armed police!
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what if that creepy loner was only there as last resort before suicide?? chasing him off may make him decide to go home and do it. may be better to sit beside him and keep a closer eye on him. In life there is no easy answer you can only prepare for the worst and hope for the best.....nmyers wrote:Part of my job as a fire inspector is inspecting "houses of worship", which we try to do annually. I probably inspect 40-50 a year. The only thing of which I am certain is: no two churches are alike, so there is no way for someone to sit at a computer & write a security plan that works for every church. Some of my churches hire off duty LEO's, some put together a group of members with firearms or LE experience, while other just pray to be spared.
One of my churches came up with a novel solution to deal with "creepy loners", such as the guy who invaded the White Settlement Church. They issue "membership cards" to all members; when a stranger shows up at the door when services are being held, they refuse him admission. They have him fill out an application, photocopy his ID, & send off for a background check; if he passes, they give him a membership card the following week.
There is no perfect solution to the security problem. There are too many psychopaths running around, when they should be in mental institutions. But, our legislators continue to ignore that problem, focusing instead on confiscating the guns of good citizens.
Neal0 -
Ever notice how the media has to label citizens involved in a self defense shooting?
They will find someway to label them as not being a regular joe citizen.
I think in their minds if they can label a person as being a security team, or former military, former LEO, or former whatever, the can justify in their own twisted minds that person having and using a gun for defense.
The media does not want you (joe citizen) owning firearms and using them for defense0 -
I wouldn?t feel comfortable sitting in church with Elizabeth Warren.Quick&Dead wrote:I believe it was Elizabeth Warren who said he wouldn't feel comfortable being in church with armed patrons.
Hell, she best get out of D.C. where the halls of Congress are filled with armed police!
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i wouldn't feel comfortable sitting in a teepee with lizabeth lie-a-watha warren 0
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